Hey Don,

Nope that was not me but I am still pushing through with the novel style deck idea that supports the idea of a carabiner. I really do not think the glow in the dark cards are worth it simply because the chemicals used do not have a long enough glow life....even the newer chemicals put out by alsa are not quite there yet. Not quite. In my opinion that is.

JJH

OK, I have been experimenting with design. I am no pro on the different graphic programs like gimp, photoshop, corel. But, it seems there are only 2 avenues to take. If you use real photos or photoshoped real photos you end up with a too "game look" set of playing cards or too "cartoonish" if you go with surreal or multiplied shape it becomes more the standard Poker back set. I am going with the later. I think it will hit a broader range of players, with tuck box, and trek case.

Thanks everyone for your comments, ok, back to more Eco friendly, bury the bright/look at me walk with the flashy cards on my back pack idea. I scheduled my trip back to the states for the 7Th of June so finally I can get this project underway. I will be purchasing the resins to start the castings when I get back the following week. The company in Montana sent a sample to someone in the states and it checked out ok, so I will be using them for the printing. They will print 200 decks and up, Lacquer, UV finish.

The problem with Eco friendly is the chemicals that I use that make up the plastics. I am experimenting with home made plastics.......corn starch, glycerin, vinegar, dyes, but for large scale it does not look feasible. The whole Eco friendly problem is this; it only applies to the manufacturing process, and that can have real hidden damaging consequences to the environment. Most chemicals are byproducts of other processes. The bio friendly process realeases co2 and other contaminates. Then, there is absolutely nothing bio friendly about a landfill which by laws in the states demand that the trash thrown in them can not decompose the trash but must serve as a holding facility only. Strict fines are imposed if any decomposition takes place. Well governed functioning land fills were excavated (Wisconsin) and newspaper over 40 years old was legible. The secret here is if a product is really biodegradeable do not throw it in the trash, but try getting that to pass with any success.

I will try as much as I can to go Eco friendly but, I have my limits. I might consider putting a tree seed inside every bamboo trek case and tell the consumer when it is time to ditch the case bury it instead and see what happens in a few years. That might work better and hopefully others will do the same in other projects for a real green project, not just use it as a sales pitch.

OK, now for the bad news. My friend who was working on design backed out because of work. Glad I have not put any time limit on myself to get this project flying. Any takers on this. I would consider making you a partner in this project or a cash payout ONCE it is successful on ks. Yep, risk, but if you have talent lets talk. If this is against the rules of this forum then please forget I mentioned anything about this. I will continue going it alone, and throw out ideas for your open suggestions.

Thanks for all your comments

Jon H.

Waiting for my friend to supply the graphics for the faces and back. Talked to Alsa again they thought it would be really cool to have a deck back in their diachromatic styles, not just the case. They have a self adhesive in a matt black, unscratchable, chemical resistant velvet to touch finish that I cant wait to see how it looks for a case, but what do you think about a back in a depth dichromatic film with a white trim in the available attached colors. Is it carrying the trek (car) theme to far, or go with a more custom card back. The attachment does not do the actual back justice. The actual laminate has a real depth(almost 3d) that is impossible to capture by a picture or drawing. Perhaps a video.

What do you think?

Jon H.

Don,

You all here keep surprising me in a good way with your great suggestions. My strength is being able to mold and cast cases at prices cheaper than anything china can put out. Simply because I do it myself. The quality is awesome and the paint is not lead based. So why not show it off a little in my programs. Cases are easy to make because if you take your time sculpting clay is a great medium to work with and your imagination is the limit, varnishes and other paints on the clay can take out the fingerprints from the molds. But, for this program I am going to use a themed industrial case for the one, and, I am leaning towards one of Alsa fx sheeting finishes for cars that can not be scratched for the sleek line appeal to others with a more distinguished class. The sheeting per case will run about $2 bringing those cases to around $2.75 my cost to make. I am looking hard at your suggestions and trying to come up with practical solutions. All my cases will have the carabiner application. Once again Don and others here, thanks for your valuable help.

Jon H.

I heard back from the company in Montanna, like I thought it would just take time. The quote was very reasonable but they are only able to make the deck with lacquer and a uv coating, They gave me quotes with price breaks at around 10,000. I am at a crossroads....this deck will not likely be used for poker, but will have more of a niche market for teens, children, and adults on the go. Thus the idea for the carabiner. They liked the project at the plant but I am concerned with quality.....any suggestions.

JJH

I am lost and confused, why would they go so far and then pull out with 26 days to go. It may of had issues but it looked doable.

JJH

hey moon,

You may be right about them not receiving many requests for just printed pages. I did write them but was amazed to learn they only take orders for 5000 decks or more for custom orders. i may be wrong on that, anyway it will be interesting to see how uspcc handles this.

The other company in Montana is also sending out a quote, they sounded very eager to help because i have another KS project ready to go when the get me the quote....special calendar project. When I have the stamping prices fixed i will start on the custom design. Writting this on my cell phone so sorry for the errors.

Hello again,

Does anyone have any experience with actega for applying coatings for playing card applications?

I also found some stateside stamping companies with for specialty shapes. I will be checking out. one is called pfl....we will see and I will let you know here.

JJH

Hello NathanCanadas,

Good questions and to be honest I do not know....however I have some ideas but nothing solid. Everything about it is custom so far. I live in a country where over half the population makes only $10.00 per month. So it would be great to do some employment here, at least on some level. There are some companies that do castings to stamp cut metal and paper products that I am planning on exploring. I could order the sheets in the states, ship them here to cut. If that does not work out then I am looking at the price going higher and higher. I want to keep the quality up and not have to resort to Indian or pvc cards that have sliding, and other quality issues. The center of the box where the hole is placed will have to be reinforced. I think others are waiting to respond, but what is your reaction to the project.....if the details can be worked out.  I am out of the loop for many things especially when It comes to lingo. What did you mean by flourishing. I am trying to kick this project off by Christmas...I doubt It will come together before then and perhaps not by then....There is much to do.

Nathan and Moon,

In my younger years (I am now over 50) I traveled with a magician and learned about cards. Who knows how many decks I bought finding the right ones for me. This deck, which was in research all today, is not rectangular, it is standard height, and comes with a clasp/key chain to attach easily to your back pack, while in the box or out. As far as fanning goes my 5 year old can fan with it. I am not sure about the name but it will evolve the same time as the face design does.....trek deck, something along those lines. Can´t wait to post pics tomarrow......who knows what the pack will say about it. I am a director of a school in Guatemala and am looking for extra funding for the kids here.

JJH

Hey Alex,

Thanks for your reply, I hope this doesn´t fall flat on its face. Or as Don put it "bring out more pine for another coffin", but I respect your advice. I am a card player, inventor, but have never tried, except for now to invent cards. I will be cutting these out on Monday and posting pictures for a critique. I will just be using blank card stock so please don´t think that I have a completed project yet. I am hoping that if the idea flies, (or at lest hovers for a short time) some of my friends or perhaps someone here can help with design. The case is unique as well, as you will soon see. The final result is I hope we can put it on KS.

Don, Good advice about checking out the fees that KS and others in line charge....including the state and fed taxes.

I added up the success projects for a year with KS and multiplied by 5%......wow. wish I would of come up with that idea.

More tomarrow, more likely posting pics on Tuesday.

JJH

Great site and thanks in advance for your input. I am new here and have been reading the topics and comments here for quite a while. I have had a completely new design idea that has been banging for a long time in my head and wanted to throw it out to hear your reaction before I take it to the next step.

We have all seen different shaped decks, and thought hmmm, nahh, or not bad, or, only if its free. Round decks, ovals etc...etc....

I made my design on: easy to hold, children can use this with no problem, never have to worry about dropping a card, easy to fan.

My question is: is it taboo to change the physical shape and destined for failure before it even gets out of the box, or go for it and see what the reaction is.

Thanks,

JJH