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Don Boyer · « **Reply #25 on:** December 20, 2011, 02:54:17 AM »

Quote from: Moon.exe on December 20, 2011, 02:11:29 AM

I just thought of something. I know the full USPCC prototypes are very expensive, but if you just wanted to see what the back design actually looks like once printed on cards...
Can the 15$ or so custom bicycle decks be printed full-bleed? You know, the ones that are marketed as gift/promotionnal, you can get them printed with photos in the back or whatever image you want... But I don't know if they have border restrictions on those.

Oh, and I know I'm supposed to be thinking of the Wonderland deck, but I just had a quick idea for another design that would be very simple, but unlike anything that has been done so far. Here's a quick question. Can you get metallic ink in any color? If the answer is yes, I might be in for some real innovation.

You can check here:
http://www.bicyclepersonalizedcards.com/

But it doesn't look like you'd be able to use this option for a full-bleed print - just a simple photo or image repeated on the card back ad infinitum.

Try this instead:
http://www.809bicycle.com/

You can order custom print Mandolin Back cards - where you can alter 100% of the front or back except for Jokers or Aces of Spades. If you just want a single back and a single front design (as if you were printing a gaff card to sell), $300 gets you 5,000 cards. You can use the Alice design on the back and put a business card or something on the front. That's the cheapest way you're going to get to test a back design as far as I can see.

I'm actually considering this for when I create business cards for myself instead of using custom-printed cards straight off the inkjet printer I have at home... I want to upgrade to a larger PO Box before I do this, and any kind of address change is a headache, even if it's from one PO Box to another. I may keep the smaller one running 'til the contract runs out in March and get the bigger one now to ease the transition - but I digress...

You can place orders for decks as well, but they cost more. However, the Mandolins in a custom deck form can be ordered in smaller batches than Rider Backs, saving you some cash.

As far as metallic inks - I see no reason why more colors wouldn't be available. What is an ink color, after all, but a mixing together of other colors?

John B. · « **Reply #26 on:** December 21, 2011, 10:25:23 AM »

Quote from: Good@Sabacc on December 18, 2011, 02:16:37 AM

I love the diamond pattern being swirled, and I also like the tracings of the other elements, the cat, etc. on the back.

I think of the shape of a playing card, and my mind is drawn to the Tea Party - it takes place at a table very similar in dimensions to a playing card. Imagine a card back of the actual Tea Party table seen from a bird's-eye view - a purplish diamond-pattern tablecloth, teacups and cake plates strewn about... It could either be an "aftermath of the party" view or a "during the party view" in which case you'd see the arms of the participants reaching over the table for the teapot and such. It wouldn't be hard to make this a symmetrical pattern and it would suit your theme nicely - you just need to leave out Alice!

A concept for the Ace - a close-up view of the Hare's pocketwatch, minute hand pointing straight up, the tip of which forms the spade. Perhaps some details of the hand holding the watch, maybe the tea party table in the background...

Please tell me you're doing some sort of transformation deck design for the number cards! And consider the design of the Tungstene deck - your pips need not always appear in the rigid, traditional pattern we've seen for so many decades; they can be anywhere on the face of the card that you want!

Another interesting idea - it seems like you want to make a black back and a white front. Some magicians moan about how certain tricks become impossible because of this (I'm often one of them!). But instead of doing what E did when they added a white border to the back of the Artifice v2, perhaps you could add a black border to the face? Make the border appear like a picture frame for the artwork - I think it could be a really gorgeous concept.

so if you have the backs as what the party looked like before hand i suggest one gaff card with what it looked liked after.

moonexe · « **Reply #27 on:** December 21, 2011, 11:59:49 PM »

What do you think of those letters? Would they be too hard to recognize in a spread/fan? $:-\$
And do you guys like my pips? I thought I could go a bit less standard on the club, made it a four-leaf clover

Edit: New attempt for the back design. I really like the purple color.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #28 on:** December 22, 2011, 11:35:03 AM »

Quote from: Moon.exe on December 21, 2011, 11:59:49 PM

What do you think of those letters? Would they be too hard to recognize in a spread/fan? $:-\$
And do you guys like my pips? I thought I could go a bit less standard on the club, made it a four-leaf clover

Edit: New attempt for the back design. I really like the purple color.

I think the pips are awesome. I'm not entirely sold on the typeface for the indices. What about one that looks more Victorian, but pushed a little harder, towards the point of "madness" in terms of curlique serifs and such? A simple handwriting typeface looks short of the mark to me.

AceGambit · « **Reply #29 on:** December 22, 2011, 12:03:39 PM »

I very much enjoy the club specifically. I think it adds a fantastic touch to pull the stem off it and add the additional petal.

moonexe · « **Reply #30 on:** December 22, 2011, 05:04:24 PM »

The reason I wanna keep the indices relatively simple is that I want the cards to be useable, not just pretty. IF I go too mad, the letters and numbers might not be recognizable in a spread or fan. $:-\$ But you're right, something more victorian in style could be a good idea, I'll see what I can find.

Also, I've been sketching court cards with a pen on a notepad

do you think I should go with a more cartoony style, or maybe something more geometry-based like the JAQK art prints? And I might go with the Gemaco orientation(flipped queens and jacks), just to add a bit of irregularity for the madness factor.

Kanped · « **Reply #31 on:** December 22, 2011, 07:05:21 PM »

The new back design is wonderful. I would quite like none of the edge borders to be square, though; I love that the other two edges 'come into' the back design; I've been waiting for someone to do that. I'd like to see what it's like on all 4 corners, though (not identical to the other 2, though) .

moonexe · « **Reply #32 on:** December 22, 2011, 10:17:17 PM »

Working on that.

Once I'm done enjoying my new Artifice deck...

MrLukeCarroll · « **Reply #33 on:** December 22, 2011, 11:37:59 PM »

Wow these are beautiful Moon, cant wait for more teaser images

moonexe · « **Reply #34 on:** December 22, 2011, 11:46:03 PM »

I'm hoping to have at least a prototype for the queen of hearts in a couple days, I'll keep you updated with that

and I might get a blank deck of bikes to inkjet myself a few tests, the same way some people make gaff cards

Don Boyer · « **Reply #35 on:** December 23, 2011, 09:21:54 AM »

Quote from: Moon.exe on December 22, 2011, 05:04:24 PM

The reason I wanna keep the indices relatively simple is that I want the cards to be useable, not just pretty. IF I go too mad, the letters and numbers might not be recognizable in a spread or fan. $:-\$ But you're right, something more victorian in style could be a good idea, I'll see what I can find.

Also, I've been sketching court cards with a pen on a notepad do you think I should go with a more cartoony style, or maybe something more geometry-based like the JAQK art prints? And I might go with the Gemaco orientation(flipped queens and jacks), just to add a bit of irregularity for the madness factor.

A "Vicky" typeface would be better, even if it wasn't "extreme".

Geometric has been done, and doesn't fit the theme unless you're going for the kind of geometry you employed on the back of the cards. Rather than cartoony, if you opt for drawn cards, I suggest using the original book art as a starting point and "warp" it just a little more to push it closer to the edge of being unreal. Aim for the fantastic!

Gemaco orientation? Bah - use Moon.exe orientation! If your indices are solidly made and readable, you can take a lot of license on the faces and get away with it.

moonexe · « **Reply #36 on:** December 24, 2011, 11:19:19 PM »

A quick christmas update

and what do you mean by "Vicky"?

Don Boyer · « **Reply #37 on:** December 25, 2011, 02:07:16 AM »

Quote from: Moon.exe on December 24, 2011, 11:19:19 PM

A quick christmas update and what do you mean by "Vicky"?

Cute sketch.

"Vicky" is short for Victorian. Some steampunk types use the term. It was popularized in the novel "The Diamond Age" by Neal Stephenson.

dmbaggs · « **Reply #38 on:** December 25, 2011, 06:02:42 AM »

I like the sketch!! It took me forever to get used to the tablet. Keep up the good work on the deck and Merry Christmas!

sinsandman · « **Reply #39 on:** December 29, 2011, 09:50:32 PM »

Moon, you are doing wonderfully. Keep up the great work and you have my support on your deck. Love it! I would like to see a borderless deck though. Everyone has gone bordered...it makes sense but I mean, it would be nice to have a borderless...I can grab any number of bordered decks if I need to do a reverse.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #40 on:** December 30, 2011, 11:14:58 AM »

Quote from: sinsandman on December 29, 2011, 09:50:32 PM

Moon, you are doing wonderfully. Keep up the great work and you have my support on your deck. Love it! I would like to see a borderless deck though. Everyone has gone bordered...it makes sense but I mean, it would be nice to have a borderless...I can grab any number of bordered decks if I need to do a reverse.

We've had the debate before on borders. He just needs to decide which market he's aiming to appeal to. A bordered deck has a more broad appeal, while unbordered is more of interest to the collector, and perhaps the cardist. Anyone wanting a deck for more general use wants a white border because the borderless designs don't wear well over time.

I'm personally enjoying where the design is going so far. Looking forward to seeing it launch.

sinsandman · « **Reply #41 on:** December 30, 2011, 03:23:00 PM »

You make a valid point. I too am supporting what route he chooses to take. Good either way.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #42 on:** December 31, 2011, 02:11:33 AM »

Moon, forgive me for going a little off-topic, but someone's Kickstarting a board game with a similar theme to your deck - check it out:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/ndef/the-hatters-table?ref=thanks

moonexe · « **Reply #43 on:** December 31, 2011, 03:43:26 AM »

$29 for the full set... I'll have to pass, too much stuff on my buying list lately.

It looks pretty cool, though. I really like the mouse in one of the banners, and the hatter looks pretty nice. But what I like the most is the box with the "Play Me" tag.

As for the border, if I go with the last design I posted here, it'll probably be a bordered black deck. Though I'm still open to a white borderless deck, it all depends on what my experimentations lead to.

I also have another deck in mind at the same time, one that would be very simplistic but still very unique, though it relies on ideas that haven't been done before and I'll have to ask the USPCC a few things to determine if it's even possible to print.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #44 on:** December 31, 2011, 05:10:43 AM »

Quote from: Moon.exe on December 31, 2011, 03:43:26 AM

$29 for the full set... I'll have to pass, too much stuff on my buying list lately.
It looks pretty cool, though. I really like the mouse in one of the banners, and the hatter looks pretty nice. But what I like the most is the box with the "Play Me" tag.

As for the border, if I go with the last design I posted here, it'll probably be a bordered black deck. Though I'm still open to a white borderless deck, it all depends on what my experimentations lead to.
I also have another deck in mind at the same time, one that would be very simplistic but still very unique, though it relies on ideas that haven't been done before and I'll have to ask the USPCC a few things to determine if it's even possible to print.

The "Play Me" one is cool - the prototype. This was apparently a class project in college.

No reason why you couldn't "go for broke" and make both borderless and bordered - a boxed set, perhaps? Price it right and I think you'll get both target audiences very solidly between the eyes.

USPC has generally not been a company to shy away from innovating in the playing cards department, but they're just as likely to really make you pay for it, if you know what I mean.

moonexe · « **Reply #45 on:** January 06, 2012, 05:50:25 AM »

There is a card in the promo deck, you'll probably know which one, with a feature that is very important in that design.

Anyway, back to Wonderland, I just came across a music video that gave me a lot of inspiration. It's korean, and you guys might have trouble listening to a song in an unknown language, but I believe music doesn't need verbal understanding to be appreciated. Here it is:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCRBG1J6i4w&feature=g-all-u&context=G22135bfFAAAAAAAACAA

Of course my concept of Wonderland is quite a bit darker, but the decors and some of the costumes in there got me very inspired(Not to mention the ridiculous expressiveness of her face...) You guys better thank that girl, because a slight flavor of transformation cards is running through my mind right now.

Of course it wouldn't be something as bold and eye-catching as Ncyclopedia's designs, but just a little something to distract from the regularity of the usual cards faces.

Don Boyer · « **Reply #46 on:** January 06, 2012, 10:21:28 AM »

That video has a very cool look to it, a very modern "Wonderland-esque" design. You could do worse than using it for inspiration.

dee1orean · « **Reply #47 on:** January 06, 2012, 05:23:55 PM »

Loving the Purple Back!!!

Frost · « **Reply #48 on:** January 17, 2012, 05:40:04 PM »

wow i like the design of the back card really cool and the ace is really cool to.

moonexe · « **Reply #49 on:** January 19, 2012, 07:11:20 AM »

Quote from: sinsandman on December 29, 2011, 09:50:32 PM

Moon, you are doing wonderfully. Keep up the great work and you have my support on your deck. Love it! I would like to see a borderless deck though. Everyone has gone bordered...it makes sense but I mean, it would be nice to have a borderless...I can grab any number of bordered decks if I need to do a reverse.

I'm going with a black border/white face design right now, I tried to figure out a way to make it look good with a white border but that failed on many occasions.
As for the court cards, I wish I could be working on them, but my mind is still fighting over what kind of artwork would be best... but I'm coming close to a compromise with myself.