Is the amount of activity here on PCF getting less?

[EndersGame]

Is the amount of activity here on Playing Card Forum dropping?

Maybe it's my imagination, but it seems like the amount of posts has dropped off here.  Examples:

- There are big Kickstarter campaigns for playing cards that aren't even being mentioned.  For instance, the Playing Card Plethora sub-forum hasn't even seen any mention of the newest Apothecary Kickstarter from Alexander Chin featuring his beautiful Seronda Sentiments & Verana Virtues decks, even though that Kickstarter has been running for almost three weeks already!  Compare that with this.

- Many of the threads announcing Kickstarters over the last three months have zero replies and no discussion, which seems somewhat surprising.

Is anything amiss at all, or is this standard fare for PCF?  It just seems awfully quiet, and not much discussion going on.

[EndersGame]

I just discovered the Stats page.

At the bottom there are stats for the number of New Posts per year, and there seems to be a real and significant downward trend:

2012: 44,347
2013: 25,462
2014: 21,421
2015: 10,645
2016: 4,592
2017: 3,827
2018: 1,332 (projected, based on the current rate of 146 posts for 40 days so far)

At that rate, the forum seems to be dying a slow death.  What accounts for this trend?  I've only been a member here since March last year, so I'm not aware of the previous history. 

[Eddie Hughlett]

I agree. I've been here since 2015 and my feelings are confirmed by the numbers you've posted. I come most every day to read and keep up with the community at large and have my own opinions as to why people don't post. I hear there are website upgrades to come and maybe the 'new and improved' site will drive more traffic. I do enjoy reading your reviews. I do hope you continue.

[Don Boyer]

Eddie is pretty much on the mark there, Ender.  I've been told by people who use this and other forums that because we're not as compatible with mobile apps, they log in here less frequently.  It's a situation that's in the process of being rectified, though it will take a little time.  In the meanwhile, I appreciate that you're still posting and checking in!

[PipChick]

I can actually hear the crickets...

[Don Boyer]

I can actually hear the crickets...

Hey! 

Yeah, I know.  It's been a bit quiet.  But I keep checking in, mostly while I'm at work, and there's usually something new to read.

A forum is what the forum's readers and contributors choose to make of it.  We are working on this end to make it a more appealing place for people to come to, but it hasn't been easy finding the right person with the right skill set to make the upgrades needed both to this site and to the club's website.  The club's site is DESPERATELY in need of an upgrade - it looks like a refugee from the early 1990s.  We've made a few attempts to get a project off the ground, but in each case a stumbling block appeared and the project fell through - which is not to say we've given up!

[EndersGame]

As I just noted in another thread, the site also loads painfully slowly at times. 

I hope something happens soon, otherwise PCF will die a slow and painful death as numbers and contributions keep dropping off.

It would be a real shame for it to go completely, there's so much valuable content that has been posted here.

[EndersGame]

I just discovered the Stats page.  At the bottom there are stats for the number of New Posts per year, and there seems to be a real and significant downward trend:

At that rate, the forum seems to be dying a slow death.  What accounts for this trend?  I've only been a member here since March last year, so I'm not aware of the previous history.

Here are the current stats, as of 7th November 2018.  Yikes - talk about a downward trend from 2013. [sad face]  Are there any plans to do anything to try to reverse this trend?

[Don Boyer]

I just discovered the Stats page.  At the bottom there are stats for the number of New Posts per year, and there seems to be a real and significant downward trend:

At that rate, the forum seems to be dying a slow death.  What accounts for this trend?  I've only been a member here since March last year, so I'm not aware of the previous history.

Here are the current stats, as of 7th November 2018.  Yikes - talk about a downward trend from 2013. [sad face]  Are there any plans to do anything to try to reverse this trend?

Our fearless leader, Lee Asher, is working to find a solution in terms of updating both this and the club's website.  That should bring things back to normal, I'd hope.

[EndersGame]

Here's some current stats, as of the halfway mark of 2019. 

Unfortunately the downward trend seems to be continuing.  Over the past 6 months, we're slightly at only one third of the 2018 figures for the year, when we should be at least half to maintain the same level of activity.

The frequency of posts so far this year is only about 5% of the level that it was at five years ago.

[Don Boyer]

Here's some current stats, as of the halfway mark of 2019. 

Unfortunately the downward trend seems to be continuing.  Over the past 6 months, we're slightly at only one third of the 2018 figures for the year, when we should be at least half to maintain the same level of activity.

The frequency of posts so far this year is only about 5% of the level that it was at five years ago.

Lee Asher has mentioned to me that there's a lot of "lurker" activity that's not well reflected in most of the numbers.  I think that having 208 people online all at one time is a reflection of this in part, even if it is the second-lowest record since the forum was founded.  What makes tracking lurkers trickier is that it's not required to have a login in order to view the posts here - while that helps us in ease of access for everyone to the information at hand, it doesn't allow us to keep good numbers on how many people are "just visiting" and don't ever post.

There's no denying that the overall number of posts is down, but we're not quite dead yet.  The more people are discussing things, the more people will want to check in to see what's being discussed and possibly even participate themselves.

[Dufus]

Here's some current stats, as of the halfway mark of 2019. 

Unfortunately the downward trend seems to be continuing.  Over the past 6 months, we're slightly at only one third of the 2018 figures for the year, when we should be at least half to maintain the same level of activity.

The frequency of posts so far this year is only about 5% of the level that it was at five years ago.

As a new member, those numbers are interesting to see.  I must admit, I do a lot of lurking as Mr. Boyer puts it.  I only log in about half the time on this site.   

[CBJ]

27000 new members in 2013 is where alex had bots create accounts to boost up membership for the sale to 52 Plus.

I think all the accounts should be culled.

[Lee Asher]

27000 new members in 2013 is where alex had bots create accounts to boost up membership for the sale to 52 Plus.

I think all the accounts should be culled.

This is a misnomer. We didn't buy this forum for the #s. As a matter of fact, we bought it to give our membership a digital house. We would have bought it if just Alex and Don were the only members.

So if you look at it from this standpoint, it doesn't matter about any figures or stats. This is a home for our membership and for those who love playing cards.

We have enough money in our treasury to run this site until 2099. We aren't going anywhere. There's no need to fear the worst.

[EndersGame]

As a matter of fact, we bought it to give our membership a digital house...  This is a home for our membership and for those who love playing cards.

Well said Lee.  And glad to hear that the site should be around for the next hundred years! [smile]

That said, it would be great to have more people who share our love for playing cards participate here.  And one has to wonder where the disappearing participants are going and why, especially because the playing card industry is a growing one, so it appears to be a reversal of the trend in the industry generally.

[Lee Asher]

Thanks Enders. A better stat for us to look at is club membership. This forum generates a lot of new members for the club. Coincidentally, they are mostly lurkers and not those actively participating. Seems like they come for the existing info.

But with that said, I also think low attendance is a factor of how people consume info these days. Lots take to Instagram and social, instead of reading threads on forums. Do you find this to be the case with your board game forum?

Again, we look at this website as a digital house for membership (an amenity). So any up or down swings aren't as relevant for us.

[EndersGame]

The amount of activity over at BoardGameGeek continues to increase.  Earlier this year they reached 2 million registered users (link), after reaching 1 million just 4 years ago.  The number of unique visitors monthly is currently over 5 million (link) and continues to grow.  That does also mean there are a lot of lurkers who haven't registered for membership but still use the site regularly.

The same trend is evident on the boardgames subreddit discussion forum at Reddit.  This is seeing phenomenal growth - subscriber #1 million was on 2 November 2018 (link) and subscriber #2 million was near the end of June 2019 (link), so it has doubled in size in the last 8 months alone.

The number of subscribers on the playing cards subreddit discussion forum (link) is also growing, and just hit 10,000 a few days ago (link).  This grows at a rate of 20-30 new members a day.  Many of these are younger and enthusiastic collectors just getting into collecting playing cards, especially modern custom decks.  But if you want to promote 52 Plus Joker and try to bring a new generation into the fold, it might be a good place to get involved, because I rarely ever see it mentioned.  There's a lot of regular activity there, with people posting photos of their newest decks, and discussing what they are interested in. 

I think you're right that the current generation is using social media much more, and Instagram and youtube in particular have a lot of influence.  Specialized discussion forums seem to be losing traction in favour of more centralized hubs like Reddit, which is huge, and extremely popular. It's easier for people to sign up for a single site that covers all their hobbies and interests, rather than registering on individual sites for each separate hobby or interest.  I frequent a few other playing card forums, including UnitedCardists and Theory11, and there's a reasonable amount of activity there as well, but not as much as on Reddit.  I'll try to get to get some stats from UnitedCardists to see how that compares with PCF.  I think that young people are less inclined to register for a site dedicated to a specific topic, because you have to be pretty immersed in the hobby to register for a site devoted specifically to it.  On the other hand sites like BoardGameGeek.com are also going from strength to strength, but that's because boardgamers tend to be a pretty dedicated bunch who really dive in deep to their hobby, and strategy boardgaming generally has really grown enormously in the last two decades. 

[Dufus]

I'm glad the site is here to stay and there are worthy administrators that are active.   It does seem odd though looking through different topics and forums where I will see almost all of them have 10,000+ views and 0-1 replies.   These numbers must be generated by 'bots'.   Hard to believe that no one has anything to say with all those views.   From a data standpoint, the numbers here must be nowhere near accurate.

[EndersGame]

It does seem odd though looking through different topics and forums where I will see almost all of them have 10,000+ views and 0-1 replies.   These numbers must be generated by 'bots'.   Hard to believe that no one has anything to say with all those views.   From a data standpoint, the numbers here must be nowhere near accurate.

True.  I've noticed this too.  Previously most reviews were showing as 20-50 views each, whereas now it is 2000+. 

The figure can't be accurate, and must be inflated by bots or something, as you say.

[Don Boyer]

It does seem odd though looking through different topics and forums where I will see almost all of them have 10,000+ views and 0-1 replies.   These numbers must be generated by 'bots'.   Hard to believe that no one has anything to say with all those views.   From a data standpoint, the numbers here must be nowhere near accurate.

True.  I've noticed this too.  Previously most reviews were showing as 20-50 views each, whereas now it is 2000+. 

The figure can't be accurate, and must be inflated by bots or something, as you say.

We do get our fair share of web spiders (bots that map out the web) as well as spambots.  We try to filter spambots as best as we can to keep them from making spam posts, but a login isn't required in order to download a post (to a web browser for a human), so we can't filter out their "views."

And yes, there are many bad accounts on the board, but we only take action on them if they're posting spam.  The problem is that you can't tell with total certainty whether an account is a bad account created by a spambot or other automata or whether it belongs to a flesh-and-blood human without expending a LOT of effort, such as contacting thousands of account holders and expecting them to respond to a notice that we're going to suspend their account if they don't reply.  That would take more manpower and man-hours than we can expend.

We can't even use something like "only keep those accounts with genuine posts" as a criteria for filtering out bad accounts because there are quite a few people who lurk and never post - they don't require a login, but they get one anyway, just in case they get inspired enough to want to post.  I'd rather leave a hundred bad accounts in place and tackle them if they become actively bad posters than risk kicking out a real person by accident in an effort to weed out the bad accounts.

[EndersGame]

Sadly, the downward trend of activity here at PCF continues.  Here is an update that includes stats from the last two years.

At the current rate for 2021, the number of new topics and new posts for this year will only be half of what it was last year.

[Don Boyer]

Sadly, the downward trend of activity here at PCF continues.  Here is an update that includes stats from the last two years.

At the current rate for 2021, the number of new topics and new posts for this year will only be half of what it was last year.

You are correct in that the traffic here is way down, though we're still getting a few hundred new accounts a year.

Do bear something in mind - this is OLD technology, this forum.  It's an off-shoot of old BBS systems, where people used to dial into a person's computer using a landline-connected modem (remember those?) and download messages, compose replies offline, then upload new ones.  Compared to modern social media, this is dinosaur-age stuff.

Eventually, I could imagine a world where the traffic on here is dead to the point where we stop supporting it - perhaps keeping an archive of it but closing out all accounts and ceasing accepting new posts.  But that would only take place in a world where we have something else to take its place - something in the social media realm that's as widely accepted and used as this forum once was.  We're working on coming up with a more effective social media strategy that will allow us to do this, but like all major changes, it takes time.  More importantly, it takes the acceptance of the members using it.

[istheis]

Have y'all considered making like a private subreddit for 52+joker members?

[EndersGame]

Whatever happens, I'd hate to see the content here disappear - there's so much valuable information in the forum threads here. 

I think it still provides a very useful function, but for some reason traffic is just dropping off, and less people are actually using it.

Perhaps that's because people are more active at other sites like United Cardists, and especially Reddit Playing Cards, which has had tremendous growth and recently hit the milestone of 25,000 subscribers. 

Maybe a lot of the younger generation just prefers using platforms like Facebook and Reddit?

[Don Boyer]

Whatever happens, I'd hate to see the content here disappear - there's so much valuable information in the forum threads here. 

I think it still provides a very useful function, but for some reason traffic is just dropping off, and less people are actually using it.

Perhaps that's because people are more active at other sites like United Cardists, and especially Reddit Playing Cards, which has had tremendous growth and recently hit the milestone of 25,000 subscribers. 

Maybe a lot of the younger generation just prefers using platforms like Facebook and Reddit?

It's the format more than the content that's causing the drop-off.  Message-based forums like this were all the rage ten-plus years ago, but now like you said, Reddit and others are far more popular with the younger Internet users.

I don't expect this forum to just disappear - we'll still be around, even if only as an archive of information.  It's not terribly expensive to run and the club is reasonably well off financially, so the funding to keep it going is there.