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Developing new card technology

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Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #25 on: February 01, 2012, 11:39:49 AM »
 

NathanCanadas

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Hey, we are planning on making a deck called the Discourse deck together, with most Discourse members. If you want, you could be a part of it. Here is the thread where we plan it all out. We could use your doodles!
http://aethercards.com/discourse/index.php?topic=1595.40
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2012, 11:48:56 AM »
 

SpiritsCrusader

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Tuck boxes that are more durable.

I absolutely agree, after just a few uses the edges and corners start bending or splitting apart and the box's break, Better box's that last would be great!
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #27 on: February 01, 2012, 11:52:00 AM »
 

zaganh

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Hey, we are planning on making a deck called the Discourse deck together, with most Discourse members. If you want, you could be a part of it. Here is the thread where we plan it all out. We could use your doodles!
http://aethercards.com/discourse/index.php?topic=1595.40

im in if you like my desighns

http://aethercards.com/discourse/index.php?topic=1584.new;topicseen#new
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #28 on: February 01, 2012, 11:57:48 AM »
 

NathanCanadas

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I do like them. Welcome. Feel free to pick what you would like to work on. All the funds with go to Aether Cards.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #29 on: February 01, 2012, 12:04:03 PM »
 

zaganh

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I do like them. Welcome. Feel free to pick what you would like to work on. All the funds with go to Aether Cards.

has anyone drawn anything for it yet are they any doodles up ? what would you like me to try help desighn ? the gaff card would be cool to draw
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #30 on: February 01, 2012, 12:04:53 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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We have just started yesterday, and there will be some doodles up by Sunday.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #31 on: February 01, 2012, 12:07:17 PM »
 

zaganh

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We have just started yesterday, and there will be some doodles up by Sunday.

i oculd do a quick doodle now if you would like of somthing ? what theme did everyone decide on ?

i just did one
« Last Edit: February 01, 2012, 12:38:12 PM by zaganh »
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #32 on: February 01, 2012, 02:25:16 PM »
 

xela

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Back on topic guys. There is an entire thread for that in D&D. :)

Don, finding the right combo can't be too impossible. take a look at Misdirections Mystery. they are based out of china but wow, their decks handle like a dream!

as for a printing company for the little guys, we would all love that, but it needs to be marketed well.
Forum Founder.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #33 on: February 01, 2012, 02:59:53 PM »
 

jriffel

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I suggested the idea that there should be a printer of playing cards dedicated to the small-run designers.  I suggested it VERY SERIOUSLY because I thought it was something whose time has come.

We all wish such a thing existed, but the economics just aren't there:: 
To set up presses, computers, fast paper cutters, a conveyor line and finishing tanks think of investing a couple million USD. 
For the humidity/temp controlled building, utilities, local fees, OSHA, environtmental waste permits for the used ink and finishing chemicals, think another couple million USD. 
Contracts for large paper stock supplies, huge ink supplies, intelligent labor for running the presses, graphics artists to re-work designs to work on the presses... lots of investment capital.
Then there's marketing/sales, production control costs, and the department that everybody hates ---- legal.
Someone that invests this much to get a good printshop running will not be able to run small playing card deck runs and keep in business.  Unless you are given a multi-million dollar grant without strings attached.
[rant]
I dont see the above happening any time soon.  The best we can try to do is show Bicycle/USPCC/Jardan corp. that they are the ruin of an entire profit center/industry.  We have to demonstrate the economic cost of ignoring or shunning the little guy. 
Perhaps we can convince USPCC to reopen the old production floor for small runs or experimental processes.
I won't hold my breath.
[/rant]
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #34 on: February 01, 2012, 03:08:04 PM »
 

Kanped

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I have a sneaking suspicion that a gifted graphic designer and chemist could find a work-around to print runs of about 100 decks for much less than USPCC and rival or better the quality.  Definitely not the thousands that we expect from a run now, though.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #35 on: February 01, 2012, 04:26:27 PM »
 

Derek

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I've always wondered why they can't make black decks on black paper. it'd be so much simpler and it would take away the chipping issues, and just look cooler overall.
You buy a Ferrari when you want to be someone. You buy a Lamborghini when you are someone. - Frank Sinatra
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #36 on: February 01, 2012, 04:28:27 PM »
 

Evan

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I've always wondered why they can't make black decks on black paper. it'd be so much simpler and it would take away the chipping issues, and just look cooler overall.
I said that in my post too. It really bothers me!
I heard that they can't find a black paper that is that good of quality
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #37 on: February 01, 2012, 04:33:45 PM »
 

moonexe

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if the paper was black, the ink color would probably not show up as well. That's what I think the problem is here, not the quality of the paper.

Kanped, I've been thinking about that too - good stock shouldn't be that big a deal, all we really need is to develop a good finish. If their prototypes are handmade and are of decent quality, it can't be that hard - it just requires equipment that no individual can afford without some serious savings.
Do we have a poker player here that is rolling on money? Or a blackjack cheat? :P
Grin like a Cheshire cat, and remember: we're all mad here.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #38 on: February 01, 2012, 04:44:45 PM »
 

Paul Carpenter

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I think one of the biggest changes that could (reasonably) happen in the production process, while boring, would be a super precise cutting method so that every card is 100% exactly the same registration as every other card. I envision a computer controlled laser cutter that optically aligns every sheet and then uses a laser to cut the cards out.

Having perfect precision would afford designers some ability to do interesting things in terms of the design, bringing details to within a micron of the edges.

Ask me why this particular subject is fresh in my mind... :)

As to printing on black stock, do get any kind of full color on it properly you'd essentially need to print a base pass in white then print the color on top of that. Otherwise, the colors will take on the black base and be very dull. Just take a black piece of construction paper and bust out some markers to see what I mean. :)
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Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #39 on: February 01, 2012, 04:50:16 PM »
 

moonexe

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I think one of the biggest changes that could (reasonably) happen in the production process, while boring, would be a super precise cutting method so that every card is 100% exactly the same registration as every other card. I envision a computer controlled laser cutter that optically aligns every sheet and then uses a laser to cut the cards out.

For a laser cutter to work out, the finish on the decks would need to be very resistant to heat, or it would melt/burn a little during the cutting and make for pretty crappy edges. And edges make or break the faro ability of a deck. :P
Grin like a Cheshire cat, and remember: we're all mad here.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #40 on: February 01, 2012, 05:19:32 PM »
 

Kanped

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Yeah, any computer controlled cutting machine could do an exactly precise job; why do you have to use lasers?  They're really expensive.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #41 on: February 01, 2012, 05:37:38 PM »
 

jriffel

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In many large paper cutters, lasers are used for precise alignment and blades are still used for the cut.  If you look on uncut sheets, you can see the registration marks and alignment symbols between the cards.  The tools are there already, for whatever reason, the marks are not used by the cutters.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #42 on: February 01, 2012, 05:44:10 PM »
 

moonexe

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Because USPCC, that's why. Pure laziness. :P
The only way to make them change would be to have casinos and other big customers actually care.
Grin like a Cheshire cat, and remember: we're all mad here.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #43 on: February 02, 2012, 10:36:40 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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It's simply a matter of quality control, regarding the cutters.  Also, there's the sharpness of the blades to take into account.  Laser cutting isn't so crazy, really - more in electric costs for running a cutting laser but less in terms of blade replacement, and every cut is sharp, not just the first few hundred on the sharp blade.


Black stock printing could be achieved if the "ink" was more like a laminate layer, like silkscreen.  If you can silkscreen a black t-shirt without having to make a white one first, I see no reason why it couldn't work on cards.  You'd have to evenly coat the cards after printing to insure a flat surface - that would be the tricky part.  Without that, the cards would never fan or shuffle smoothly.
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Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #44 on: February 02, 2012, 01:17:08 PM »
 

jriffel

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Black stock printing could be achieved if the "ink" was more like a laminate layer, like silkscreen.  If you can silkscreen a black t-shirt without having to make a white one first, I see no reason why it couldn't work on cards.  You'd have to evenly coat the cards after printing to insure a flat surface - that would be the tricky part.  Without that, the cards would never fan or shuffle smoothly.
That's getting to be a pretty thick card!  It would be tricky to keep it flexible enough with enough of a snap to keep everyone fairly happy.
 

Re: Developing new card technology
« Reply #45 on: February 02, 2012, 03:39:39 PM »
 

Gunshy1

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smooth magic finish needs to happen. or half smooth half air-cushioned magic finish.
have you heard the word???