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Wait what?

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Wait what?
« on: May 09, 2012, 02:50:20 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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So. The other day I went to Rite Aid and bought a 4 deck set with 2 black rider back Bikes and 2 red standard bikes. The box advertised both colors as rider backs although the red decks were really standards. Now, here's where it gets funny. I opened the deck, and right out of the box noticed that the deck had a much more oily but smooth finish than other bicycle standards I own. I also noticed these faro only one way, and traditionally. The box says "Erlanger, KY". I haven't handled a new deck of red Rider Backs from Ohio in a while, but I was wondering if it is possible that these were actually made in Ohio with a Kentucky box? And the finish seems closer to Linoid finish on a deck of Ohio Tallys than a normal Air-cushion finish. The seal is black. Does any one have any details or info they can give me?
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2012, 03:33:43 PM »
 

max

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Perhaps I am not the best to answer as I am a sealed decks collector but I have heard many times that when USPC moved to Erlanger they packed old rider decks in new boxes so perhaps this is the case.

Another similar thing happened with seals.... Black seals on old rider boxes with new and old decks. And those rare decks with colored jokers on boxes with just the logo instead of the regular box back....

I imagine a terrible mess around this move moment, with a lot of things mixed (old boxes, new cards, new boxes, old cards....). Perhaps you find a hamburger inside a riders box :)


By e way, can you post any photo of the set? not sure if I have seen it before....
« Last Edit: May 09, 2012, 03:35:12 PM by max »
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2012, 03:36:56 PM »
 

Joshua Robinson

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I suggest you check the normal joker, that will say where the deck was produced so I have a box of Aladdins in front of me, and the box says Ohio, but the joker says Erlanger
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Re: Wait what?
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2012, 04:39:55 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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So.
Facts leading to Kentucky: Black Seal, box says "Erlanger Kentucky", colored joker, guarantee joker saying "Kentucky".
Facts leading to Ohio: Traditionnal faro, better handling.
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2012, 08:58:21 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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So.
Facts leading to Kentucky: Black Seal, box says "Erlanger Kentucky", colored joker, guarantee joker saying "Kentucky".
Facts leading to Ohio: Traditionnal faro, better handling.


They're simply Kentucky-made.  The joker tells you where.


I'm guessing they were made at some point near the end of '10 or later - that's when they worked out the kinks in the new factory and the quality is now higher than Ohio decks.


Check the four digits to the left of the letter code.  First two digits are the week of the year, next two digits are the last two digits of the year that the deck was made.


BTW: Air Cushion and Linoid are THE SAME, called by USPC internally "standard finish".  They weren't always but they are now.
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Re: Wait what?
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2012, 10:47:38 AM »
 

NathanCanadas

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I can't find the code you are talking about. Can you plz post a pic?
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2012, 06:14:27 PM »
 

xela

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The code is on the Ace of Spades, the Jokers reveal which plant.
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Re: Wait what?
« Reply #7 on: May 11, 2012, 06:25:43 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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It says 0811, so either August 2011 or the 8th week of 2011, I'm guessing. It's funny cause these handle great and I love the feel to them although they clump very quickly.
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #8 on: May 12, 2012, 12:31:19 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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It says 0811, so either August 2011 or the 8th week of 2011, I'm guessing. It's funny cause these handle great and I love the feel to them although they clump very quickly.

Eighth week of 2011, so near the end of February.  Definitely made in Erlanger, possibly during the initial "shakedown" period when card quality was an issue - transition cards were printed a good number of months earlier.  By now, that shakedown is over, but it did last about a year-and-a-half.
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Re: Wait what?
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2012, 08:00:30 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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How come the Ohio Limited edition Vintage Series reprint decks aren't dated on the AoS? They have a code, but it doesn't belong with the date (mine says 1613)
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2012, 08:29:12 PM »
 

Assassino13

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So.
Facts leading to Kentucky: Black Seal, box says "Erlanger Kentucky", colored joker, guarantee joker saying "Kentucky".
Facts leading to Ohio: Traditionnal faro, better handling.


They're simply Kentucky-made.  The joker tells you where.


I'm guessing they were made at some point near the end of '10 or later - that's when they worked out the kinks in the new factory and the quality is now higher than Ohio decks.


Check the four digits to the left of the letter code.  First two digits are the week of the year, next two digits are the last two digits of the year that the deck was made.


BTW: Air Cushion and Linoid are THE SAME, called by USPC internally "standard finish".  They weren't always but they are now.

I'd have to disagree about Erlanger being higher quality. I think the stock was much snappier from Ohio, as well as all the finishes being better. All my Kentucky decks have rougher edges than my Ohio decks too.
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2012, 08:45:41 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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Another question: I have a deck of maroon Rider backs. Jokers and box say they are made in Ohio. The code on the AoS says "4806". Was it made in 2006?
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2012, 01:58:39 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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How come the Ohio Limited edition Vintage Series reprint decks aren't dated on the AoS? They have a code, but it doesn't belong with the date (mine says 1613)

Are those numbers to the LEFT of the letter, or to the RIGHT?  The numbers to the LEFT of the letter would reveal the week and year of manufacture, while the numbers to the RIGHT would reveal the lot number of the print run and isn't really of use to anyone outside of USPC.  Older Ace of Spades letter codes have NO digits to the left of the letter, making them only able to be pinpointed to the year of manufacture and not any smaller time units.  Unless of course you had the records at USPC indicating which lots were printed when.


I'd have to disagree about Erlanger being higher quality. I think the stock was much snappier from Ohio, as well as all the finishes being better. All my Kentucky decks have rougher edges than my Ohio decks too.

Any Erlanger decks manufactured in 2011 and 2012 are actually of better quality than the Ohio printings because more modern equipment was in place and the "shakedown" period was over.  Decks made in those years (AoS letter codes of N for '11 and R for '12) no longer have the rough edges that the Kentucky-made decks from 2009 (letter code L) and 2010 (letter code M) tended to have.

And in regard to the boxes, there's no guarantee that a black-sealed box marked "Cincinnati" has Cincinnati-made cards in it.  Blue seal decks were made before the transition to Kentucky, but black seal decks have roughly even odds of having been made in Erlanger for 2009 and for some brands, 2010.  They had the boxes pre-printed before the move and obviously didn't want to waste them, since they did cost money to make in the first place.  Only the guarantee Joker will tell you for certain what plant made the deck.

Another question: I have a deck of maroon Rider backs. Jokers and box say they are made in Ohio. The code on the AoS says "4806". Was it made in 2006?

If "4806" appears to the LEFT of the letter code, and the letter in the code is "H", then it was made in the 48th week of 2006, putting it at early December of that year.

Another thing to bear in mind is that for customized decks, often the letter code isn't used at all - the maroon Rider Backs (also called "burgundy" by some) were a private order.  That deck and the yellow Rider Backs were printed for The Bond Agency, a.k.a. The Card Collector, doing business at cards4magic.co.uk.  If you go over the T11, E, D&D, Blaine, TBC/HOPC and other privately-designed and privately-ordered decks, they usually do not have AoS codes.  The T11 "brass" version of the Steam Punk deck had no letter code, but the USPC "copper" version does (I believe it was "N", but late in the year, as the deck was released January of this year).  I have no idea what the "silver" USPC version will have, but if forced to guess, I'd say it'll have a letter code, that code being "R".
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Re: Wait what?
« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2012, 01:30:57 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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The Maroon deck doesn't have a letter code... And the Vintage series has an H in front (on the left of) the 4 letters. So that means it's 2006, right?
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #14 on: June 28, 2012, 11:23:00 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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The Maroon deck doesn't have a letter code... And the Vintage series has an H in front (on the left of) the 4 letters. So that means it's 2006, right?


You read what I wrote below, right?  Here, I'll quote it for you:


Another question: I have a deck of maroon Rider backs. Jokers and box say they are made in Ohio. The code on the AoS says "4806". Was it made in 2006?

If "4806" appears to the LEFT of the letter code, and the letter in the code is "H", then it was made in the 48th week of 2006, putting it at early December of that year.
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Re: Wait what?
« Reply #15 on: June 28, 2012, 12:42:18 PM »
 

NathanCanadas

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On the Marroon deck, there is no letter code!
And on the Vintage series decks, the letters are 1612 and appear on the right of the letter code. That means that they represent the batch number. But since the letter code on this deck is H, is it still from 2006?
And how can I know the date for the marroon deck?
 

Re: Wait what?
« Reply #16 on: June 28, 2012, 09:52:11 PM »
 

Don Boyer

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On the Marroon deck, there is no letter code!
And on the Vintage series decks, the letters are 1612 and appear on the right of the letter code. That means that they represent the batch number. But since the letter code on this deck is H, is it still from 2006?
And how can I know the date for the marroon deck?


Do you hate reading that much?  I'm sorely tempted to just leave you hanging, but I'm feeling generous...


Look, another quote, this time about the maroon deck...




Another thing to bear in mind is that for customized decks, often the letter code isn't used at all - the maroon Rider Backs (also called "burgundy" by some) were a private order.  That deck and the yellow Rider Backs were printed for The Bond Agency, a.k.a. The Card Collector, doing business at cards4magic.co.uk.


So, this tells you letter coding won't work here - and look, there's the contact info for the company that made the deck!  Perhaps if you ask them nicely, they'll tell you what you want to know...


Now, about that "H" letter code...let's see here...oh, I wrote this, didn't I?


First, about those fiddly lot numbers:




Are those numbers to the LEFT of the letter, or to the RIGHT?  The numbers to the LEFT of the letter would reveal the week and year of manufacture, while the numbers to the RIGHT would reveal the lot number of the print run and isn't really of use to anyone outside of USPC.  Older Ace of Spades letter codes have NO digits to the left of the letter, making them only able to be pinpointed to the year of manufacture and not any smaller time units.  Unless of course you had the records at USPC indicating which lots were printed when.


And now, the "H" code itself...


Another question: I have a deck of maroon Rider backs. Jokers and box say they are made in Ohio. The code on the AoS says "4806". Was it made in 2006?

If "4806" appears to the LEFT of the letter code, and the letter in the code is "H", then it was made in the 48th week of 2006, putting it at early December of that year.


If these quotes do not answer your questions, nothing I have to offer you will.


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« Last Edit: June 28, 2012, 09:54:25 PM by Don Boyer »
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