Why does everyone hate on alex but not...

[john]

So i was having a conversation with a few people and this topic came up. Why does everyone hate alex for his shipping but no one even complains about lance. According to his last update he doesn't even have the freaking decks yet! And in my opinion that is 100x worse then late shipping. So please offer your opinion on the matter down bellow.

[Aaron]

i wonder about that too, I said it once here and someone bitched me out.

[Don Boyer]

So i was having a conversation with a few people and this topic came up. Why does everyone hate alex for his shipping but no one even complains about lance. According to his last update he doesn't even have the freaking decks yet! And in my opinion that is 100x worse then late shipping. So please offer your opinion on the matter down bellow.

Most of us realize that once a project is in the hands of USPC, there ain't squat you can do about it but wait for when they get around to printing and shipping it.  It's hard to fairly blame someone for something not under their control.

[john]

So i was having a conversation with a few people and this topic came up. Why does everyone hate alex for his shipping but no one even complains about lance. According to his last update he doesn't even have the freaking decks yet! And in my opinion that is 100x worse then late shipping. So please offer your opinion on the matter down bellow.

Most of us realize that once a project is in the hands of USPC, there ain't squat you can do about it but wait for when they get around to printing and shipping it.  It's hard to fairly blame someone for something not under their control.

I think we all just assume USPC had the artwork since december. Someone correct me if im wrong but has lance ever said "USPC has the finished artwork." Obviously they have it now because the uncuts are printed but im talking about before printing has started.

[xela]

As a stalker and backer of KS projects, some take a month to ship out, some take a year. There are a few notorious ones that have taken longer than that.

Some that take a month to ship out are very hard to produce gadgets. Some that take a year are as simple as cloth wallets. Sometimes the gadgets take a year, and the easy stuff takes a month. Most of the time it's in between.

Looking back at my KS experience, I got it better than others in my position. It looked worse than it ended up being, because the loudest twats that attacked me never pledged for any decks, bought any decks, or had anything to do with the project in the first place. Backers saw these loudmouths, and assumed the worst. These folks claimed I was scamming them, and they posted this on literally every place my backers check. Naturally some people thought this was true.

I will say that the whole "once it is at USPCC it's out of your hands" thing is false. Even my hold ups were mostly on my end. I believe Lance mentioned something to that extent as well. The hold ups are not avoidable, really. Mistakes are made, designs must be perfected, etc. The USPCC does not put projects on hold for a year though. My decks were ready to be printed in December, but I had to modify artwork, work out a reasonable contract, figure out how to get things to resellers, etc. Then I had to wait on a reseller certificate.

It takes time. Anyone that pledges for KS thinking it's a straight up pre-order is just wrong. I got screwed by a few morons that thought it would be fun to troll myself and my backers and spread lies and rumors. I don't wish that on Lance or anyone else. I think if people aren't yelling at him and fucking with him, then good, that's how it should be, and eventually the decks will arrive.

Oh, also people are very melodramatic, and act like Internet detectives. I try not to update or post much anymore, since every word I say is incorrectly picked apart by some folks. I said I was shipping most packages parcel post, and when I shipped a few pledge levels with priority instead, I got problems there as well.

tl;dr: Who cares if nobody is attacking Lance. How is that a bad thing? :|


EDIT: Also, attacks on me have died down quiiiite a bit lately, since the whole "get him! he's scamming you!" argument falls short when hundreds of people get their shipments. XD I love the majority of my backers, and I made some awesome contacts. Knowing these folks is totally worth dealing with assholes.

[Don Boyer]

Alex, those are all good points.  But it is true that in a significant number of cases, it's USPC where the hold-ups occur.  A proof that's off, the wrong color ink, every little piddling detail...  There's no way to put an accurate time table on it.  Sometimes you get lucky and the process is smooth as glass.  Many times, however, the process has any number of bumps between the start and the finish.  I'd say the latter occurs more than the former, though to varying degrees.

Just out of curiosity, John:

Are you waiting for a delivery on something from him?  (Presumably the Black and White Editions of the Actuators...)  And if you aren't, why the hell are you even concerned?

Have you tried simply asking him for a heads-up on the decks?  He does log in here from time to time, and there's also his KS page and his store page - no shortage of ways to try reaching him.

[xela]

Alex, those are all good points.  But it is true that in a significant number of cases, it's USPC where the hold-ups occur.  A proof that's off, the wrong color ink, every little piddling detail...  There's no way to put an accurate time table on it.  Sometimes you get lucky and the process is smooth as glass.  Many times, however, the process has any number of bumps between the start and the finish.  I'd say the latter occurs more than the former, though to varying degrees.

Just out of curiosity, John:

Are you waiting for a delivery on something from him?  (Presumably the Black and White Editions of the Actuators...)  And if you aren't, why the hell are you even concerned?

Have you tried simply asking him for a heads-up on the decks?  He does log in here from time to time, and there's also his KS page and his store page - no shortage of ways to try reaching him.

It seems like he's asking about community reactions rather than trying to get a riot against Lance. I believe the two are buds.

[john]

Alex, those are all good points.  But it is true that in a significant number of cases, it's USPC where the hold-ups occur.  A proof that's off, the wrong color ink, every little piddling detail...  There's no way to put an accurate time table on it.  Sometimes you get lucky and the process is smooth as glass.  Many times, however, the process has any number of bumps between the start and the finish.  I'd say the latter occurs more than the former, though to varying degrees.

Just out of curiosity, John:

Are you waiting for a delivery on something from him?  (Presumably the Black and White Editions of the Actuators...)  And if you aren't, why the hell are you even concerned?

Have you tried simply asking him for a heads-up on the decks?  He does log in here from time to time, and there's also his KS page and his store page - no shortage of ways to try reaching him.

I'm not concerned though... It is simply a question that was discussed between myself and a few others. I felt the question was worthy of aether to start discussion.

Also, if anyone thinks im taking shots at lance im not. Him and i are great friends and i have the utmost respect for him. As i said before, it is simply a question to stir up discussion.

[lancetmiller]

So i was having a conversation with a few people and this topic came up. Why does everyone hate alex for his shipping but no one even complains about lance. According to his last update he doesn't even have the freaking decks yet! And in my opinion that is 100x worse then late shipping. So please offer your opinion on the matter down bellow.

This is a good question, one I have actually asked myself. It's not that there haven't been complaints. On the contrary, you can see numerous instances on the Kickstarter where people have voiced their opinions about the deck taking too long. I couldn't agree more. This deck took way too long, and I've been in nail-biting suspense waiting for the day when everyone demanded their money back. The fact is, it's not coming, and I'm thankful. That means you guys have stuck with me through, easily, one of the biggest projects in my young career. For that, I am more grateful than words could ever express.

I will say this: while on site at USPCC this week, I settled the shipping matter and the decks are already on their way to my house! So what does that mean? That means that as soon as I get the decks, we will begin fulfillment. Kickstarter Backers of course will be the #1 priority. You guys know how I roll. So what you'll see is this: I will have the decks very early this week, and Mike (BM Pokerworld), Jason Arakellian (the1eyedjack.com) and John Aragi (AceKing) will get their decks at the same time. That's called drop shipping and doesn't mean that I don't care about you guys, it's just how the retail world works. They get shipped factory direct so they can have them for the launch date. Other than that, all other decks will be shipped from me to backers and my pre-order customers on my site and you all should know by now, I won't sleep until everyone has their packages. Especially after this wait.

What else can I say, Alex is a great kid, with great ideas. I'm a little sad he's gotten a bad rap, but you guys should take note, that we're pioneers here. We're treading a new path and that will always be lined with obstacles that are different for each of us. It takes infinite patience on the part of the creators (especially when backers get frustrated) and more patience still for the backers who are literally bringing into creation that which we ourselves could not fund otherwise. If you're the kind of person that can't wait to have decks, Kickstarter may not be right for you as a backer, but if you can discern that the person you're backing will go the extra mile to make sure you're more than satisfied with the results, then back a project and be supportive. At that point, you're not just funding a project, you're helping someone live a dream. I can't tell you how many emails I got telling me everything was alright and that they weren't mad at me or disappointed in anyway. That was amazing, it was the most uplifting feeling and it affirmed that it's been well perceived that I have done everything in my power to get the decks at the quality you all expect as fast as I could hope to get them.It's possible the next deck you see from me won't even come from Kickstarter, but you can bet that I will take everything I've learned and do everything 100% better the next time around.

Finally, I'll close with this: Paul Carpenter, Russel Kercheval, Adam Clarkson, Alex Yusupov, myself, and the rest of the Kickstarter gang you've all come to know and love (or loathe), talk and share ideas so that each time we can get a little better than the last. We look out for each other and share the utmost respect for one another, because we understand what it's like to be in the trenches alone. Yet, though we have our personal support for one another, your continued fan support is what keeps us creating, and drives us to innovate. Without the community we'd be nothing, and I can tell you that every single one of us Independent developers shares that mentality.

This last bit is a question from over on UC. I figured I'd add it here because it's good for you guys to know

Hmmm well Jaspas (Jaspas Deck) got them already and shows off in his latest cardistry
video "our Legacy".
BMPokerworld will have them next week too.
I guess Lance will show up and post something regarding shipping ;-)
Don't worry he is one of the good guys.

In regards to this piece of information ^ This is actually misunderstood. Jaspas doesn't have the B&W's.... he has fake versions called Prototypes that cost $250 each to produce (only 4 were made). The same goes for all the promotional photos you've seen on my website. They're fakes! They're mean to look like the final product in every way possible so that we can do promotional photography, video representations, and so we can film the explanations of the magic effects built in to the decks. Hopefully that clears some things up.

As always, the most humble of regards to you all,

Lance T. Miller

[vmagic]

I don't see how anyone can compare Alex and Lance! It's like comparing apples and oranges, there's no comparison. Also, you can't fault Lance for not having the decks yet, that is in the USPC's hands. The only thing Alex did right for me was to cancel my order!

[xela]

I don't see how anyone can compare Alex and Lance! It's like comparing apples and oranges, there's no comparison. Also, you can't fault Lance for not having the decks yet, that is in the USPC's hands. The only thing Alex did right for me was to cancel my order!

Based on what you wrote on UC... you're the guy that requested an Amazon refund? There was one guy who got a refund through Amazon. They didn't give out any information but the transaction #, which is useless for me because the purchases were made via KS. I couldn't contact you (or whoever it was) and all I could do was ship the decks and hope the guy would let me know so I don't ship his out. Clearly that didn't happen.

I sent out your decks days ago, so enjoy your free decks. If you decide to pay for your products, let me know. Also, thanks for lying to Amazon and saying I never responded to you. I made tons of updates letting people know when decks were going out. You posted everywhere asking, and you were answered.

EDIT: The decks were sent before I had any idea the refund went through.

[john]

Vmagic i hope you pay alex for those decks... it's the right, non asshole thing to do

[John B.]

knowing vmagic, he will complain about them soon as he gets by coming on here and saying how bad they were and how alex took to long and start an argument.i

[xela]

knowing vmagic, he will complain about them soon as he gets by coming on here and saying how bad they were and how alex took to long and start an argument.i

That would be all kinds of messed up since he didn't pay for them as of now.

[vmagic]

First of all I don't recall getting any direct personal response to messages I sent you regarding stuff whether on here or kickstarter or on facebook and secondly I don't mind paying for them, not that I already didn't before getting refunded, but I don't know how I would do that because I can't use Paypal.

I even have the messages on kickstarter still awaiting a response to prove it and probably here and elsewhere. We all know his customer service is lacking to say the least.

Btw John, I already have a Vortex deck that I got ages ago from a reseller and did a very nice review of them, that was before everything went downhill with it. I have no complaints with the deck and think it is really nice but the service ain't the best as we all know.

Also for the record I had no idea you didnt know who you were refunding and I figured if I sent a message on kickstarter that I would never get a response. I apologize for the problems this caused. I never wanted to cancel the thing but after waiting so long I decided I had waited enough and I know i'm not the only one to cancel.

[xela]

First of all I don't recall getting any direct personal response to messages I sent you regarding stuff whether on here or kickstarter or on facebook and secondly I don't mind paying for them, not that I already didn't before getting refunded, but I don't know how I would do that because I can't use Paypal.

I even have the messages on kickstarter still awaiting a response to prove it and probably here and elsewhere. We all know his customer service is lacking to say the least.

Btw John, I already have a Vortex deck that I got ages ago from a reseller and did a very nice review of them, that was before everything went downhill with it. I have no complaints with the deck and think it is really nice but the service ain't the best as we all know.

Also for the record I had no idea you didnt know who you were refunding and I figured if I sent a message on kickstarter that I would never get a response. I apologize for the problems this caused. I never wanted to cancel the thing but after waiting so long I decided I had waited enough and I know i'm not the only one to cancel.

I actually appreciate you mentioning it. My responses to your questions were answered in my updates. I am sorry that I missed out on your KS messages. I always reply to requests or inquiries outside of "when are my cards shipping?"

Customer service isn't my forte. I think that much is obvious.

Anyway, if you'd like you can pay your pledge level on KS to PayPal which is spektralex@gmail.com. I'll upload your tentative tracking number to there as well (it's international, so don't bet on it working after it leaves the US).

Since I did send them a week ago, I'm thinking you'll have them within a week.

Sorry to single you out like that vmagic.