Not a good start for JumpStartCity.

[Rob Wright]

So a couple designers have started promoting decks on the new site. Wow, what a process. You have to first get 500 votes, which can take 3 weeks, before you can even really start promoting your deck for 3 weeks. Then you can actually go active with funding. So it could be 6 weeks before you even start funding.

The not so good start is- I can't vote. I logged in. I go to vote. It says please log in. Repeat several times with no success. OK so let me try to contact JSC. Fill out the form. put in the distorted code. Error- code incorrect. repeat several times. It reminds me of the idiots that put projects on KS before doing all the research, and making sure their shit works.

Don't think I will be going back soon.

[Soliloquy]

And this business of advancing in "rank" according to how many projects you vote on, and then having your vote count even more, is seriously unbalanced.

[Don Boyer]

And this business of advancing in "rank" according to how many projects you vote on, and then having your vote count even more, is seriously unbalanced.

It doesn't sound promising at all.  It's a shame, since Kickstarter, nice as it can be, has serious flaws and could use some serious competition to shake things up a bit.  It doesn't look like JSC will be that competition.

[xela]

And this business of advancing in "rank" according to how many projects you vote on, and then having your vote count even more, is seriously unbalanced.

It doesn't sound promising at all.  It's a shame, since Kickstarter, nice as it can be, has serious flaws and could use some serious competition to shake things up a bit.  It doesn't look like JSC will be that competition.

IndieGoGo definitely is a competitor for KS. They've had some huge projects recently and although people find their TOS sketchy, I find it to be far more honest. Yes, creators can keep your money if the project doesn't get funded. Yes, they are not bound to deliver the rewards.

The best part?

The site tells you explicitly that that is the case. None of that KS bullshit where it's "yeah the creator has to refund you if shit fails, but we offer ZERO ways of doing so! trololololo"

Over there, it's basically "if you want to donate, donate, but there is a chance you'll be screwed, and we don't care, so if you don't like that then gtfo."

They're less popular, and understandably so, but I have yet to see an indiegogo scandal where as KS is trite with them.

I mean, if you walk into Best Buy and the guy says "this TV is probably broken but you can buy it at full price if you want to"  and then you buy it, and it's broken, you can't really blame anyone but yourself, can you? That's how I view IndieGoGo.

JSC seems very confusing to me, though. I don't like the sign up process at all.

[Don Boyer]

IndieGoGo definitely is a competitor for KS. They've had some huge projects recently and although people find their TOS sketchy, I find it to be far more honest. Yes, creators can keep your money if the project doesn't get funded. Yes, they are not bound to deliver the rewards.

The best part?

The site tells you explicitly that that is the case. None of that KS bullshit where it's "yeah the creator has to refund you if shit fails, but we offer ZERO ways of doing so! trololololo"

Over there, it's basically "if you want to donate, donate, but there is a chance you'll be screwed, and we don't care, so if you don't like that then gtfo."

They're less popular, and understandably so, but I have yet to see an indiegogo scandal where as KS is trite with them.

I mean, if you walk into Best Buy and the guy says "this TV is probably broken but you can buy it at full price if you want to"  and then you buy it, and it's broken, you can't really blame anyone but yourself, can you? That's how I view IndieGoGo.

JSC seems very confusing to me, though. I don't like the sign up process at all.

A quick comparison:

Jump Start City
0 projects under "deck cards"
3 projects under "playing cards", all of which are still in the "elevator pitch" phase (Including one twice-failed project from Kickstarter).

Indiegogo
0 projects under "deck cards"
7 projects under "playing cards", of which:
   4 failed with less than 10% of goal (one of which was a failed KS project)
   1 failed with less than 75% of goal
   1 succeeded - Zach Mueller's Fontaine deck, complete with tuck box print errors courtesy of USPC
   1 is active - currently at 5 backers, C$69/C$6,000, and no art on the home page of the deck itself, which apparently is still in the early design phase.  Dig deeper and you see three pieces of art, perhaps one of which even resembles a playing card (and only if you use your imagination).  No deck back, no tuck box, just that.  It's plain to see the project creator has never made a playing card project before, and did I mention that it's one of the infamous "flex funding" campaigns?

Kickstarter has had ten projects just in the past week...

From my perspective, JSC creates too many hurdles to cross for backers as well as creators, while IGG will have a hard time shaking its sketchy reputation - not that Kickstarter is all that and a bag of chips, either.  KS has a veneer of respectability that's beginning to wear off due to its all-bark, no-bite "anti-fraud" policies.

[Alex Willis]

I like the concept and direction of JSC, and I like that it uses Paypal instead of Amazon payments as most people I know use Paypal.  And I understand the filtering to keep bad projects off the grid, there's nothing worse than looking through bad projects to get to the ones you like.  But the thresholds are unrealistic.  At best I could bring 300 people to vote, but not 500.  And that's assuming they want to take the laborious task of creating an accounting, figuring out the log in problems, understanding exactly where and how to vote if they can even find the project.  For a June 1 kickoff, they've failed miserably with no projects for people to pledge on.  Their montra, only guaranteed successful projects will be hosted here.  But many projects only succeed because they reach an audience who would be otherwise unaware.

Guess i'll stick with KS.

[blastercast]

Yeah, looking at this I think I will be going kickstarter for my deck,
JSC needs too many "voters" and the only people I can really advertise to are my twitter followers, magicians I know and you guys so 500 is a long shot
indieGoGo was the one I was planning for but it seems to be treated as a last resort, I just prefer that they don't take as much a cut as KS, plus the advertise active campaigns a lot more
JSC needs to lower it's threshold because otherwise it won't get off the ground properly
-Benny

[Alex Willis]

I see that 8-bit has thrown their hat in the ring on JSC with
http://jumpstartcity.com/events/8-bit-playing-cards-bicycle-traditional-5400

[Don Boyer]

I see that 8-bit has thrown their hat in the ring on JSC with
http://jumpstartcity.com/events/8-bit-playing-cards-bicycle-traditional-5400

Didn't this thing ALREADY have a successful Kickstarter campaign??  WTF??

[Alex Willis]

I see that 8-bit has thrown their hat in the ring on JSC with
http://jumpstartcity.com/events/8-bit-playing-cards-bicycle-traditional-5400

Didn't this thing ALREADY have a successful Kickstarter campaign??  WTF??

It's a new audience (mostly) and a way to unload lots of extra decks.  I know crowd funding sites are supposed to help you get projects off the ground, but once you're off you find that you have a ton of baggage weighing you down (like 3,000 extra decks of cards).  Someone then tells you that there is a brand new batch of folks with cash!  Yay, problem solved.  Unload the excess and there you go.

To be honest, I thought it was the 2600 deck that got funded on KS, this is the 5400.  Atari enthusiasts will tell you, it's not the same thing.

[Rob Wright]

I think there is 9-8-Bit decks now. I may be wrong, but if you go to there website. You can see the different(not so different, except color) uncut sheets. Not sure if they are lazy or genius. I hope they can come up with another idea.
http://www.homerungames.com/Site/Home_Run_Games.html

[Alex Willis]

I think there is 9-8-Bit decks now. I may be wrong, but if you go to there website. You can see the different(not so different, except color) uncut sheets. Not sure if they are lazy or genius. I hope they can come up with another idea.
http://www.homerungames.com/Site/Home_Run_Games.html

What's that old saying... "if it ain't broke... take a bat to it"?

[Don Boyer]

To be honest, I thought it was the 2600 deck that got funded on KS, this is the 5400.  Atari enthusiasts will tell you, it's not the same thing.

...to say nothing of the 7800, 400, 800 and 1200...

(My first game box was a Magnavox Odyssey 2 - predates the Atari 2600 by at least 2 YEARS...)

[Alex Willis]

To be honest, I thought it was the 2600 deck that got funded on KS, this is the 5400.  Atari enthusiasts will tell you, it's not the same thing.

...to say nothing of the 7800, 400, 800 and 1200...

(My first game box was a Magnavox Odyssey 2 - predates the Atari 2600 by at least 2 YEARS...)

Now you're dating yourself.

[Don Boyer]

To be honest, I thought it was the 2600 deck that got funded on KS, this is the 5400.  Atari enthusiasts will tell you, it's not the same thing.

...to say nothing of the 7800, 400, 800 and 1200...

(My first game box was a Magnavox Odyssey 2 - predates the Atari 2600 by at least 2 YEARS...)

Now you're dating yourself.

Why not?  I'm the easiest date I know!   

But yeah, back on topic...  Not holding a lot of hope for JSC unless it changes its model...

[Rob Wright]

My cousin had the ColecoVision. He also had the Tandy computer w 7" external floppy disk dr. And my other cousin had the Commodore 64. I finally had the 2600. My cousin with the Coleco, haaaaad to get the 5400. I wanted the 5400(laying on back, arms and legs flailing)!

[Don Boyer]

My cousin had the ColecoVision. He also had the Tandy computer w 7" external floppy disk dr. And my other cousin had the Commodore 64. I finally had the 2600. My cousin with the Coleco, haaaaad to get the 5400. I wanted the 5400(laying on back, arms and legs flailing)!

Yeah, the TRS-80...  I used the Model I at school, BEFORE the floppy disk.  Used a cassette-tape drive that took 30 minutes to load a 16kb program (which maxed out the RAM)...  My watch has more processing power...

[Rob Wright]

7 days in. 1 project has received enough votes to go on to the promotional stage. It actually made the vote level about mid week. For some reason, the project has not been transferred to the next stage. Not sure if this is the fault of JSC, or the creator has already given up. At this point it would be at least another 3 weeks before the 1 project could start funding.
I understand what they are trying to do- to weed out the bad projects. They forgot a fundamental part of sales. Sell the first time, because you may not get another chance. People are impulse buyers. I sell Insurance for a major company. When I get somebody on my line. I know if I do not sell right then. Nine out of ten times they are going to a different company.
Kickstarter needs some competition. If JSC doesn't make some major changes quickly. They won't be it.

[Don Boyer]

7 days in. 1 project has received enough votes to go on to the promotional stage. It actually made the vote level about mid week. For some reason, the project has not been transferred to the next stage. Not sure if this is the fault of JSC, or the creator has already given up. At this point it would be at least another 3 weeks before the 1 project could start funding.
I understand what they are trying to do- to weed out the bad projects. They forgot a fundamental part of sales. Sell the first time, because you may not get another chance. People are impulse buyers. I sell Insurance for a major company. When I get somebody on my line. I know if I do not sell right then. Nine out of ten times they are going to a different company.
Kickstarter needs some competition. If JSC doesn't make some major changes quickly. They won't be it.

Your points are all too valid.  As sketchy as many people think IndieGoGo is, it's more viable as a competitor to Kickstarter than JumpStartCity is at present.  Without an overhaul, the concept's going to collapse under its own weight.

[Alex Willis]

So last week I received an email from the creators of JSC expressing that visits are dropping dramatically and that they've "reconsidered" their voting practice and for the time being they will reduce the vote levels to allow people who have more than 300 which would have pushed quite a few into the next bucket.  (still not available to pledge on however).  7 days later and guess what?  No change.  They had a follow up message this week saying that they are about to get more press on it... my question is, on what?  There needs to be good options to Kickstarter and while Indiegogo does a fair job, they are highschool baseball compared to the pros.  JSC isn't even at Little League level.  If we don't watch out, KS will become the eBay of the online Auction world.  Can anyone say Monopoly?
I hoped seriously JSC would fill the void, but they can't even seem to keep their word much less manage a system that promotes peer funding.