Here to Stay or Gone Tomorrow.

[John B.]

Now days I try to get 3 of a deck. One to use, one to trade, and a back up/give to a friend.

[MrMollusk]

Yeah, I never bought any of the Blue Tune Decks. I didn't see what the big fuss was about those - at all!

The only Decks I bought and regret are for completely separate reasons. I pledged for the Steampunk Deck from Reagan (http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1762124010/steampunk-playing-cards?ref=live) to checkout the quality of Bhrama's printing. They're horrible looking! I only got 1 Deck. My daughter (4 years old at the time) liked it so I gave it to her. Who knows where those cards are today!!

The other regret is getting 3 of the Pedale Deck. I got suckered in by his KS Video of being a poor designer barely making enough for a crappy car..... Once I got the cards I realized the style with the big noses and odd faces was something I hate. The Back Design and Tuck Box were each pretty boring in person.

thanks, Randy

Really? I quite liked the Pedale deck. It was fresh and new, and it's also nice to have at least one 1-way deck. The court cards were, in my opinion, very interesting and the box was pretty cool too.

The backs really needed to be fixed though, and he did it with his V2 deck.

Different strokes for different blokes, I guess.

[Don Boyer]

Staying on topic, I think the original crown decks are absolutely beautiful. Simplistic, Elegant & Functional. The Blue Crown is chasing a ghost when it comes to living up to the The Crown Deck. That's NOT an insult to other decks TBC produced since. It just says something about how incredible the crown deck was. Crown Deck sellout records speak for themselves.

I've spoken with Kevin about this before - the biggest reason for the rapid sell-out of the first-edition red and blue Crowns was that they only printed a small supply, having no idea how popular they would be.  Once they realized the demand was there, they printed the green first-edition deck in larger quantities, which is why it's a bit more common and less costly in the post-retail market than the other two colors.  They're still solid performers and very good decks.

The Blue Crown, as a single entity (meaning without HOPC) is no longer as focused on playing cards.  They sell Crowns and a few others, but they tend to be special-interest decks to the magic community.  Altruism had a treasure hunt associated with it, Vaudeville was an homage to magicians from nearly a century ago, NOC 2.0 are marked for suit, and then there's the Crowns, in original and gaffed varieties.  They're aimed more heavily at the magic/cardistry market now, with HOPC being the branch of the company that's all about the decks.

This was intentional when HOPC was created, allowing TBC to expand the audience for their decks.  Sure, first-edition Crowns sold out in record time, but they also did VERY well with several of their other decks, not the least of which being the red Verve deck, the Ornates and the Curator decks.  Even now, NOC 2.0 sold out of the blue within days of them being introduced - I think they're still working on getting them back in stock.

My point in all this is that TBC will likely never have another deck that sells out like the first-edition Crowns, because they're not pushing standard decks as much as the instructional materials, gaffed decks and trick-related gadgets.  HOPC, on the other hand, will likely have quite a few.

(And yes, they did very well selling out the Luxury Editions of the Crowns as well - nice work, Randy!)

[Card Player]

Staying on topic, I think the original crown decks are absolutely beautiful. Simplistic, Elegant & Functional. The Blue Crown is chasing a ghost when it comes to living up to the The Crown Deck. That's NOT an insult to other decks TBC produced since. It just says something about how incredible the crown deck was. Crown Deck sellout records speak for themselves.

I've spoken with Kevin about this before - the biggest reason for the rapid sell-out of the first-edition red and blue Crowns was that they only printed a small supply, having no idea how popular they would be.  Once they realized the demand was there, they printed the green first-edition deck in larger quantities, which is why it's a bit more common and less costly in the post-retail market than the other two colors.  They're still solid performers and very good decks.

The Blue Crown, as a single entity (meaning without HOPC) is no longer as focused on playing cards.  They sell Crowns and a few others, but they tend to be special-interest decks to the magic community.  Altruism had a treasure hunt associated with it, Vaudeville was an homage to magicians from nearly a century ago, NOC 2.0 are marked for suit, and then there's the Crowns, in original and gaffed varieties.  They're aimed more heavily at the magic/cardistry market now, with HOPC being the branch of the company that's all about the decks.

This was intentional when HOPC was created, allowing TBC to expand the audience for their decks.  Sure, first-edition Crowns sold out in record time, but they also did VERY well with several of their other decks, not the least of which being the red Verve deck, the Ornates and the Curator decks.  Even now, NOC 2.0 sold out of the blue within days of them being introduced - I think they're still working on getting them back in stock.

My point in all this is that TBC will likely never have another deck that sells out like the first-edition Crowns, because they're not pushing standard decks as much as the instructional materials, gaffed decks and trick-related gadgets.  HOPC, on the other hand, will likely have quite a few.

(And yes, they did very well selling out the Luxury Editions of the Crowns as well - nice work, Randy!)

I want to let this go and stay on topic. However, ...

What you are saying sounds like TBC BS. They mix brands (TBC & HOPC) when its convenient for them. Alex might have separate budgets and accounting for each but there is no clear cut business philosophy difference when it comes to playing cards as I see it.

Kevin is the same guy that told me White Arrco's were not produced by TBC because TBC was about original productions, not reprints. Yet, in 2013 we now have TBC White Alladin's? Philosophy's change, as I know and you have pointed out (Don Boyer: "They're aimed more heavily at the magic/cardistry market now"). The word "NOW" implicates that change. When HOPC sells something that customers have a bad reaction about (London 2012), guess what? It tarnishes TBC brand. No one cares that TBC/HOPC says they are separate.

TBC Summer Club: 2 limited NOC deck's. As we all know NOC's to be a HOPC product, now they are TBC?

I understand your point and appreciate the information about the Crown Decks record sellout times. Please, don't tell me about the philosophy differences of TBC and HOPC. I don't want to hear/read it anymore. Actions speak much loader then their words.

[Don Boyer]

I want to let this go and stay on topic. However, ...

What you are saying sounds like TBC BS. They mix brands (TBC & HOPC) when its convenient for them. Alex might have separate budgets and accounting for each but there is no clear cut business philosophy difference when it comes to playing cards as I see it.

Kevin is the same guy that told me White Arrco's were not produced by TBC because TBC was about original productions, not reprints. Yet, in 2013 we now have TBC White Alladin's? Philosophy's change, as I know and you have pointed out (Don Boyer: "They're aimed more heavily at the magic/cardistry market now"). The word "NOW" implicates that change. When HOPC sells something that customers have a bad reaction about (London 2012), guess what? It tarnishes TBC brand. No one cares that TBC/HOPC says they are separate.

TBC Summer Club: 2 limited NOC deck's. As we all know NOC's to be a HOPC product, now they are TBC?

I understand your point and appreciate the information about the Crown Decks record sellout times. Please, don't tell me about the philosophy differences of TBC and HOPC. I don't want to hear/read it anymore. Actions speak much loader then their words.

White Arrcos, as listed on the box, are a product of New York Magic Project, an entity Kevin created before joining TBC.

It's possible that TBC carried the Aladdins because a) customers wanted it, b) it's a popular cardistry deck and c) there is a stripper version of the deck as well.

The "now" refers to the time since HOPC was created.

If the London 2012 decks were reacted to so poorly, why did they sell out?  People don't usually buy something they react poorly to.  I don't recall anyone complaining about Alex or Kevin holding a gun to anyone's heads, forcing them to click "Add to Cart".

I mentioned before that NOC 2.0 decks are marked for suit, making them a magic accessory.

[Card Player]

I want to let this go and stay on topic. However, ...

What you are saying sounds like TBC BS. They mix brands (TBC & HOPC) when its convenient for them. Alex might have separate budgets and accounting for each but there is no clear cut business philosophy difference when it comes to playing cards as I see it.

Kevin is the same guy that told me White Arrco's were not produced by TBC because TBC was about original productions, not reprints. Yet, in 2013 we now have TBC White Alladin's? Philosophy's change, as I know and you have pointed out (Don Boyer: "They're aimed more heavily at the magic/cardistry market now"). The word "NOW" implicates that change. When HOPC sells something that customers have a bad reaction about (London 2012), guess what? It tarnishes TBC brand. No one cares that TBC/HOPC says they are separate.

TBC Summer Club: 2 limited NOC deck's. As we all know NOC's to be a HOPC product, now they are TBC?

I understand your point and appreciate the information about the Crown Decks record sellout times. Please, don't tell me about the philosophy differences of TBC and HOPC. I don't want to hear/read it anymore. Actions speak much loader then their words.

White Arrcos, as listed on the box, are a product of New York Magic Project, an entity Kevin created before joining TBC.

It's possible that TBC carried the Aladdins because a) customers wanted it, b) it's a popular cardistry deck and c) there is a stripper version of the deck as well.

The "now" refers to the time since HOPC was created.

If the London 2012 decks were reacted to so poorly, why did they sell out?  People don't usually buy something they react poorly to.  I don't recall anyone complaining about Alex or Kevin holding a gun to anyone's heads, forcing them to click "Add to Cart".

I mentioned before that NOC 2.0 decks are marked for suit, making them a magic accessory.

Yes Don, we know what NYMP is.

When did London 2012 ever sellout? Nothing playing cards actually sells out in this business. Only the specific quantity sellers want to sell get sold out. There is always a brick or hundred being held in reserve. I know why that is. No, I don't call taking teenagers money, holding a gun to someone's head. No one holds a gun to all those kickstarter backers of terreble decks either. TBC/HOPC should be above London 2012 as a professional magic/playing card producing company. Again, my point is customers hold the TBC responsible dispite efforts to make HOPC seprete.

And... I mentioned to you before that TBC and HOPC mix brands when its convenient for them. Hence NOC's are sold on both websites. I see marked decks on HOPC (NOC's) and I see "normal" universally usable decks on TBC.