Gatorback Riders from David Blaine

[hecrob]

Theres an extra card on the table... the one with a man "sitting" and a hoodie.... Any ideas if its a gaff card? promo card?

[Card Player]

Theres an extra card on the table... the one with a man "sitting" and a hoodie.... Any ideas if its a gaff card? promo card?

I have an answer for you per attached photo.

I believe the Red were printed after (separate from) the Green and Black. The card you see is the Real or Magic tour logo. It could be a replaced extra card OR a gaff card David had made that's not part of the deck.

[aldazar]

Got a chance to play with the black gators for a bit... The missing metallic inks really make a big difference to me! I'm not a big fan of green in general, but definitely prefer the greens in this series because to me, the metallic inks make a night and day difference. Also, the green gator on the tuck makes for a nice splash of color which is more visually interesting than silver on black (tho silver on black is still a classic and very nice looking).

[Justin O.]

Fingers crossed for a red gator on the tuck. That would look pretty fantastic. Fed 52 reserve notes, HoTB sherlock decks, Whispering Imps, all of my favorite tucks are black with spot red coloring.

[Card Player]

Fingers crossed for a red gator on the tuck. That would look pretty fantastic. Fed 52 reserve notes, HoTB sherlock decks, Whispering Imps, all of my favorite tucks are black with spot red coloring.

I'd be very surprised if the gator on the tuck was not red.

Anyone notice the darkness of the red? These look metallic red to me. FYI: Not only did the double-backer get replaced but the joker font is now identical. All leading me to believe this is a separate print run from the original Green & Black.

First Print Run
-Metallic Green Limited
-Black Unlimited
Second Print Run
-Metallic Red Limited?
-Color (Blue) Unlimited?

[Don Boyer]

Fingers crossed for a red gator on the tuck. That would look pretty fantastic. Fed 52 reserve notes, HoTB sherlock decks, Whispering Imps, all of my favorite tucks are black with spot red coloring.

I'd be very surprised if the gator on the tuck was not red.

Anyone notice the darkness of the red? These look metallic red to me. FYI: Not only did the double-backer get replaced but the joker font is now identical. All leading me to believe this is a separate print run from the original Green & Black.

First Print Run
-Metallic Green Limited
-Black Unlimited
Second Print Run
-Metallic Red Limited?
-Color (Blue) Unlimited?

Technically, they're all separate print runs.  Any time you change a color, USPC charges for a second run.  You might finagle them to cut you a break if the second color uses the exact same faces, but that's about it.

Every single deck David Blaine does is a limited edition!  It's just that some are more limited than others.

We don't know for certain that the red backs are metallic - they do appear dark, but that can simply be because a darker shade was chosen.  Nor do we know how limited they are or whether they'll be "accompanied" by a fourth color.

[Card Player]

Fingers crossed for a red gator on the tuck. That would look pretty fantastic. Fed 52 reserve notes, HoTB sherlock decks, Whispering Imps, all of my favorite tucks are black with spot red coloring.

I'd be very surprised if the gator on the tuck was not red.

Anyone notice the darkness of the red? These look metallic red to me. FYI: Not only did the double-backer get replaced but the joker font is now identical. All leading me to believe this is a separate print run from the original Green & Black.

First Print Run
-Metallic Green Limited
-Black Unlimited
Second Print Run
-Metallic Red Limited?
-Color (Blue) Unlimited?

Technically, they're all separate print runs.  Any time you change a color, USPC charges for a second run.  You might finagle them to cut you a break if the second color uses the exact same faces, but that's about it.

Every single deck David Blaine does is a limited edition!  It's just that some are more limited than others.

We don't know for certain that the red backs are metallic - they do appear dark, but that can simply be because a darker shade was chosen.  Nor do we know how limited they are or whether they'll be "accompanied" by a fourth color.

Technically yes, they are all separate but they changed more then the color, they changed the art. The red most likely was added-on after the Green and Black either were set to be printed or had already been printed.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say there is a forth color. We don't know, sure. My post was more of a predication, rather a fact.

[aldazar]

First Print Run
-Metallic Green Limited
-Black Unlimited
Second Print Run
-Metallic Red Limited?
-Color (Blue) Unlimited?

We don't know for certain that the red backs are metallic - they do appear dark, but that can simply be because a darker shade was chosen.  Nor do we know how limited they are or whether they'll be "accompanied" by a fourth color.

If only there was some way to express uncertainty with punctuation... Oh wait! I know! Let's use a question mark at the end of points we are uncertain about! =P

[Card Player]

First Print Run
-Metallic Green Limited
-Black Unlimited
Second Print Run
-Metallic Red Limited?
-Color (Blue) Unlimited?

We don't know for certain that the red backs are metallic - they do appear dark, but that can simply be because a darker shade was chosen.  Nor do we know how limited they are or whether they'll be "accompanied" by a fourth color.

If only there was some way to express uncertainty with punctuation... Oh wait! I know! Let's use a question mark at the end of points we are uncertain about! =P

Yes, if only.

Don was partying like a rockstar at 1:27 AM when he posted that? <<<

[Don Boyer]

Hardy har har.   

May we get back on topic?  I get that you're speculating.  I've only seen Blaine make one deck with four colors available in sizable quantities, and that was the Split Spades Lions.  First they came in blue, red and black (the sepia box, as we know, only holds blue cards - the color was considered but rejected, however they already had some boxes printed up and didn't want to waste them).  Then a few years later, Silver Split Spades were introduced - Blaine's first deck with metallic ink.

Technically you could say that the While Lions came in four colors - Series A & B Blue, Series A & B Red, Black Label and the "Rainbow series" purple deck.  But that purple deck was not only very rare, it was more of a side effect, the result of changing colors mid-run when printing the blues and reds.  I never saw a purple deck, but I did see a purple uncut sheet in his office - looks really nice.

My point is that he's not known for doing four colors.  Not saying it's impossible, just saying it's improbable.

Original Split Spades (Tally Ho) - 3 colors
Bee Split Spades - 2 colors
Split Spades Lions - initially 3 colors, 4th added a few years later
White Lions - 3 colors, with a few outliers like the purple and UV blue decks

I think I have them all, right?

[Rose]

Red Gatorbacks!

I think the black has much more impact for this design, but still cool.

[Card Player]

Hardy har har.   

May we get back on topic?  I get that you're speculating.  I've only seen Blaine make one deck with four colors available in sizable quantities, and that was the Split Spades Lions.  First they came in blue, red and black (the sepia box, as we know, only holds blue cards - the color was considered but rejected, however they already had some boxes printed up and didn't want to waste them).  Then a few years later, Silver Split Spades were introduced - Blaine's first deck with metallic ink.

Technically you could say that the While Lions came in four colors - Series A & B Blue, Series A & B Red, Black Label and the "Rainbow series" purple deck.  But that purple deck was not only very rare, it was more of a side effect, the result of changing colors mid-run when printing the blues and reds.  I never saw a purple deck, but I did see a purple uncut sheet in his office - looks really nice.

My point is that he's not known for doing four colors.  Not saying it's impossible, just saying it's improbable.

Original Split Spades (Tally Ho) - 3 colors
Bee Split Spades - 2 colors
Split Spades Lions - initially 3 colors, 4th added a few years later
White Lions - 3 colors, with a few outliers like the purple and UV blue decks

I think I have them all, right?

For some reason every time you and I debate about Blaine, you always try comparing Blaine's current releases with his past product line. Example: Blaine never used metallic inks before so its highly unlikely. Well now he uses metallic inks... Blaine never uses 4 colors... Well now he might? Blaine does not live in a box. Nothing Blaine does is predictable. Yet time and time again you make him seem like this robot person that does everything the same way. He's the complete opposite.

[aldazar]

For some reason every time you and I debate about Blaine, you always try comparing Blaine's current releases with his past product line. Example: Blaine never used metallic inks before so its highly unlikely. Well now he uses metallic inks... Blaine never uses 4 colors... Well now he might? Blaine does not live in a box. Nothing Blaine does is predictable. Yet time and time again you make him seem like this robot person that does everything the same way. He's the complete opposite.

Have you considered the possibility that it actually has very little to do with Blaine but more to do with the fact that Don just enjoys telling people they're wrong? Or, to be more charitable, is a contrarian who likes to take the opposite position to everything? Most likely if you had suggested the possibility that the red deck would be the last one in the series, you'd have gotten a a paragraph telling you why you're wrong and we don't know for certain and here's a bunch of random facts implying that there might be another deck...

That's my guess from hanging around these forums for a while anyway... It's definitely interesting to view from a psychological perspective... =P

[Card Player]

For some reason every time you and I debate about Blaine, you always try comparing Blaine's current releases with his past product line. Example: Blaine never used metallic inks before so its highly unlikely. Well now he uses metallic inks... Blaine never uses 4 colors... Well now he might? Blaine does not live in a box. Nothing Blaine does is predictable. Yet time and time again you make him seem like this robot person that does everything the same way. He's the complete opposite.

Have you considered the possibility that it actually has very little to do with Blaine but more to do with the fact that Don just enjoys telling people they're wrong? Or, to be more charitable, is a contrarian who likes to take the opposite position to everything? Most likely if you had suggested the possibility that the red deck would be the last one in the series, you'd have gotten a a paragraph telling you why you're wrong and we don't know for certain and here's a bunch of random facts implying that there might be another deck...

That's my guess from hanging around these forums for a while anyway... It's definitely interesting to view from a psychological perspective... =P

Yes, I've considered that many times but I'd be "wrong" to say so.

[Don Boyer]

For some reason every time you and I debate about Blaine, you always try comparing Blaine's current releases with his past product line. Example: Blaine never used metallic inks before so its highly unlikely. Well now he uses metallic inks... Blaine never uses 4 colors... Well now he might? Blaine does not live in a box. Nothing Blaine does is predictable. Yet time and time again you make him seem like this robot person that does everything the same way. He's the complete opposite.

Have you considered the possibility that it actually has very little to do with Blaine but more to do with the fact that Don just enjoys telling people they're wrong? Or, to be more charitable, is a contrarian who likes to take the opposite position to everything? Most likely if you had suggested the possibility that the red deck would be the last one in the series, you'd have gotten a a paragraph telling you why you're wrong and we don't know for certain and here's a bunch of random facts implying that there might be another deck...

That's my guess from hanging around these forums for a while anyway... It's definitely interesting to view from a psychological perspective... =P

Yes, I've considered that many times but I'd be "wrong" to say so.

It's much simpler than you both make it out to be.  Card Player made a speculation, I made a speculation, done.  There's no wrong or right - we're both just guessing.

Please feel free to disagree with me at any time - I'm as human as the next member and I make mistakes.  I'd rather know the truth than be "right".  I beg of you - prove me wrong each and every time that I am wrong!  When it comes to learning the truth, my ego is NOT part of the equation.  Truth comes first, my personal opinions or sore feelings come a distant second, if at all.  If I've bruised other people's egos a bit, for that I'm very sorry.  I will never, ever censor anyone for disagreeing with me, especially if I'm only speculating.

Now, for something a little closer to the topic...

I was indeed surprised when Blaine started using metallic inks.  Were I to venture a guess, I'd say it's because he figured out how to do them right!  In most metallic-ink decks, the designer doesn't do anything with the black and it looks flat in comparison.  Blaine jazzed his up with some green metallic ink and they now have a subtle but noticeable effect which to me makes them blend in with the other metallic inks better.  But again, it's just my guess.

[Will W.]

For some reason every time you and I debate about Blaine, you always try comparing Blaine's current releases with his past product line. Example: Blaine never used metallic inks before so its highly unlikely. Well now he uses metallic inks... Blaine never uses 4 colors... Well now he might? Blaine does not live in a box. Nothing Blaine does is predictable. Yet time and time again you make him seem like this robot person that does everything the same way. He's the complete opposite.

Have you considered the possibility that it actually has very little to do with Blaine but more to do with the fact that Don just enjoys telling people they're wrong? Or, to be more charitable, is a contrarian who likes to take the opposite position to everything? Most likely if you had suggested the possibility that the red deck would be the last one in the series, you'd have gotten a a paragraph telling you why you're wrong and we don't know for certain and here's a bunch of random facts implying that there might be another deck...

That's my guess from hanging around these forums for a while anyway... It's definitely interesting to view from a psychological perspective... =P

Yes, I've considered that many times but I'd be "wrong" to say so.

It's much simpler than you both make it out to be.  Card Player made a speculation, I made a speculation, done.  There's no wrong or right - we're both just guessing.

Please feel free to disagree with me at any time - I'm as human as the next member and I make mistakes.  I'd rather know the truth than be "right".  I beg of you - prove me wrong each and every time that I am wrong!  When it comes to learning the truth, my ego is NOT part of the equation.  Truth comes first, my personal opinions or sore feelings come a distant second, if at all.  If I've bruised other people's egos a bit, for that I'm very sorry.  I will never, ever censor anyone for disagreeing with me, especially if I'm only speculating.

Now, for something a little closer to the topic...

I was indeed surprised when Blaine started using metallic inks.  Were I to venture a guess, I'd say it's because he figured out how to do them right!  In most metallic-ink decks, the designer doesn't do anything with the black and it looks flat in comparison.  Blaine jazzed his up with some green metallic ink and they now have a subtle but noticeable effect which to me makes them blend in with the other metallic inks better.  But again, it's just my guess.

I for one enjoy the speculation by all parties. I find it more interesting when facts and trends are brought in and I like it that someone steps up to be the devils advocate in these discussions.  So what if it just so happens to be Don who takes on that role more than most.   

I have learned an enormous amount about the playing card industry, its distant past and its more recent past both by reading discussions like this on this board and I find it invaluable information that I probably would not have gotten anywhere else.  So I thank you all for your input.
I may be talking out of turn here but I just wanted to throw in my 2 cents. 

[BiggerDee]

DB is smart...as long as his cards sell like hotcakes, he'd be remiss not to at least consider multiple colors. I don't get all of the hate against re-colors. Not everyone likes all of their decks to be blue. Or red. Multiple colors give folks the opportunity to purchase potentially new an unique colors, one of which they may greatly prefer over the others. I really like these cards, and have a "quantity" of each. That said, I do like some colors more than others. I bought more of the greens than the blacks because I like the design a lot, but I have a lot of black cards, so it's almost more of the same. You have to think of colors like designs. USPCC cards are pretty much Bike or Bee stock. Your collection might be 90% Bike and 10% Bee. You keep buying because new and exciting designs come out for the cards, the cards that feel the same (for the most part) as the last 50 decks that you bought. It's the same for colors. They feel the same, it's just that some people really prefer one color over another. I think that's great, that buyers aren't limited to one color but rather are given the opportunity to buy other colors that may become available. I wouldn't mind seeing more colors of exotic designs. If you simply must have a "Full set", you're going to spend some coin. If you're buying for fun, you may select one or two colors, and pass on the rest. The key point is that there's a choice, just as you have more choices than a Rider Back to purchase from! DB can print all 16.7 million colors if he'd like, more power to him. In this day and age, especially with the recent innovations of foil on cards, raised inks, printing inside of tucks, die cutting tucks and cards, you name it, I welcome any and all decks, even re-colors, that are released for my consideration. It's an exciting time to be a fan of cards and collecting! Enjoy the ride!

[see_squared]

DB is smart...as long as his cards sell like hotcakes, he's be remiss not to at least consider multiple colors. I don't get all of the hate against re-colors. Not everyone likes all of their decks to be blue. Or red. Multiple colors give folks the opportunity to purchase potentially new an unique colors, one of which they may greatly prefer over the others. I really like these cards, and have a "quantity" of each. That said, I do like some colors more than others. I bought more of the greens than the blacks because I like the design a lot, but I have a lot of black cards, so it's almost more of the same. You have to think of colors like designs. USPCC cards are pretty much Bike or Bee stock. Your collection might be 90% Bike and 10% Bee. You keep buying because new and exciting designs come out for the cards, the cards that feel the same (for the most part) as the last 50 decks that you bought. It's the same for colors. They feel the same, it's just that some people really prefer one color over another. I think that's great, that buyers aren't limited to one color but rather are given the opportunity to buy other colors that may become available. I wouldn't mind seeing more colors of exotic designs. If you simply must have a "Full set", you're going to spend some coin. If you're buying for fun, you may select one or two colors, and pass on the rest. The key point is that there's a choice, just as you have more choices than a Rider Back to purchase from! DB can print all 16.7 million colors if he'd like, more power to him. In this day and age, especially with the recent innovations of foil on cards, raised inks, printing inside of tucks, die cutting tucks and cards, you name it, I welcome any and all decks, even re-colors, that are released for my consideration. It's an exciting time to be a fan of cards and collecting! Enjoy the ride!

I couldn't agree more BiggerDee!  Blaine has a wonderful way of designing cards with Stutzman that allow for wonderful color changes.  That being said, the GatorBacks look best in Green simply due to the nature of the subject (the same way the Imps look best in red due to the subject)....I do love the shade of red used for the GatorBacks in the photo above...not sure if it's metallic or not but it pops nicely.  I imagine the gator on the front of the tuck to be in a red foil. 

[Anthony]

I think design has a lot to do with how a recolor is received. If the design itself is eyecatching it kind of rolls to phase two, which you mentioned Bigger Dee......what color you like most. I have to agree with Chris, certain desings lend themselves well to the "Concept" of th the deck, Imps with Red, Gators with Green as he mentioned. But look at other decks going through recolors and getting a bit of ribbing about it..........Daniel Madison, I loved the original Dealers and Players, I did pick up the White Rounders because of the tuck, but wasn't rushing to get the recolors.......why, because the design wasn't as intricate in my opinion. Now take the flip side, Artifice.........a slew of recolors, but I have them all.......why, I like the back design.

In the end, like you said Bigger Dee, if it sells, have at it. Options are always good for consumers and collectors........we just need to be "Grown Ups" and not blame the company for our weaknesses, lol

POKEMON.........Got a have em all! 

[Card Player]

I think design has a lot to do with how a recolor is received. If the design itself is eyecatching it kind of rolls to phase two, which you mentioned Bigger Dee......what color you like most. I have to agree with Chris, certain desings lend themselves well to the "Concept" of th the deck, Imps with Red, Gators with Green as he mentioned. But look at other decks going through recolors and getting a bit of ribbing about it..........Daniel Madison, I loved the original Dealers and Players, I did pick up the White Rounders because of the tuck, but wasn't rushing to get the recolors.......why, because the design wasn't as intricate in my opinion. Now take the flip side, Artifice.........a slew of recolors, but I have them all.......why, I like the back design.

In the end, like you said Bigger Dee, if it sells, have at it. Options are always good for consumers and collectors........we just need to be "Grown Ups" and not blame the company for our weaknesses, lol

POKEMON.........Got a have em all! 

It would be great to have 4 or 5 colors of this particular back design. As long as Blaine is making money and he knows what the correct quantity to print is based on the first two releases. I say, why the F#$% not? I actually think a White Ink on White Emboss tuck for a Blue back would be really sweet. That's basically what I envisioned when I first mentioned them here.

[Don Boyer]

I think the thing that irks some is they feel like it's a "cash grab", especially when the colors aren't released all at once but are dripped and drizzled out over several releases and months if not years.  It feels like a cash grab ONLY if you're one of those completists who feels compelled to have every variant - I knew of a guy who was actually trying to get one of every PRINT RUN, referring to them as being different "versions" of the deck, even though the differences, if any, were barely worth a footnote.

I like some recolorings just fine, personally.  A little variety is cool, especially if you don't just collect or perform but actually play with your cards.  Artifice I liked, but I personally felt they jumped the shark when they came out with the first printing of purple with those crazy same-but-reverse colored pips and when they release Artifice Ghost - er, I mean "Artifice Tundra"...  That last one felt more like they'd run out of original ideas and were just slapping two things together, chucking them at the wall and seeing if they'd stick.  Artifice was different enough without incorporating the Ghost aesthetic into it.

I'd love seeing green, black, red and blue - with two colors "plain" on heavy stock and two colors "metallic" on softer stock.  In other words, a deck to pair with green using the same paper and faces, and a deck to match with black using the same paper and faces.  Will it happen?  I haven't got a bleedin' clue.

[Collector]

...the GatorBacks look best in Green simply due to the nature of the subject (the same way the Imps look best in red due to the subject)....

+1

"Rainbows" are the problem for those collectors who want have all decks in their collection but with really different courts. They have their right to criticize the "rainbow" approach in modern playing card production. But I noticed more irony in this thread than anger, actually. Which is good as it shows that the forum's residents are mainly realists.

[Rob Wright]

I've never been a fan of multiple color changes. As Don mentioned, I'm in the camp of seems to be a money grab, but there are always exceptions. In this case, I have the green, but not the black. I do like the red though. I'm not sure how many green decks were sold, but at $5 a piece. That could not have been a huge money maker. He also could have sold double, triple what was sold. In this case doesn't seam to be a huge money grab. Unlike the Kings deck- sold out in 4 days, and mysteriously found a bunch more to sell the next week.

[Don Boyer]

I've never been a fan of multiple color changes. As Don mentioned, I'm in the camp of seems to be a money grab, but there are always exceptions. In this case, I have the green, but not the black. I do like the red though. I'm not sure how many green decks were sold, but at $5 a piece. That could not have been a huge money maker. He also could have sold double, triple what was sold. In this case doesn't seam to be a huge money grab. Unlike the Kings deck- sold out in 4 days, and mysteriously found a bunch more to sell the next week.

I think it's not so much "found" as "arrived, pre-ordered".

[Card Player]

I've never been a fan of multiple color changes. As Don mentioned, I'm in the camp of seems to be a money grab, but there are always exceptions. In this case, I have the green, but not the black. I do like the red though. I'm not sure how many green decks were sold, but at $5 a piece. That could not have been a huge money maker. He also could have sold double, triple what was sold. In this case doesn't seam to be a huge money grab. Unlike the Kings deck- sold out in 4 days, and mysteriously found a bunch more to sell the next week.

I think it's not so much "found" as "arrived, pre-ordered".

Funny how they knew to order more Kings before the first decks were ever sold. Why would E pay more per deck by having 2 separate prints. Or was it that USPCC got them printed in a week after E sold out? Doubtful

If being sold out and then more arriving 1 week later is a sales ploy, then it was not planned out very well. I suspected something was not right when E announced they were sold out in days. You notice when companies sell out for real, nothing is mentioned. They just sell out.

"Rainbows" are the problem for those collectors who want have all decks in their collection but with really different courts. They have their right to criticize the "rainbow" approach in modern playing card production. But I noticed more irony in this thread than anger, actually. Which is good as it shows that the forum's residents are mainly realists.

They become problems when it's a color change for a deck that is not well regarded. It's all on how its being offered to people. The 4 P's (price, product, promotion, and place).

I don't think Blaine is going to do every color in the rainbow. 4 is a good number.