Bicycle/unbranded Different Deck (KS)

[bhong]

So I have a question for you all.  I just saw on Max Playing Cards blog that the sticker pledge at $30ish dollar is actually a secret pledge for the sticker and 4 decks and maybe an extra 2 black decks. Meaning it is a great bargain for a potential of 6 decks. My question is the following: is this allowed on Kickstarter? IS there a false expectation created here and it is up to the creator to decide if he will send decks or not? I am not saying in anyway that the creator is trying to pull a fast one but I can just see the new trend starting on kickstarter. Pledge $30 and you might get 20 decks or then again you might not

This is the article I am referring to

Regarding the pledges, you can choose among many of them, but there is one specially interesting, the H.O.P.E. sticker one. Although you are supposedly to get just one sticker in this level ($37), there is a cool gift hidden on it. Every of the (up to) 620 backers will receive two extra decks of each branded/unbranded model. That’s four decks plus the sticker but, if the project reaches the stretch goal, two extra black decks will be added to the reward. Black decks? Have you said black decks? Didn’t you mention there are only two decks in the campaign? Well, I said this project is full of secrets so you have to read everything carefully.

Of course, you have to trust on the creator to pledge for that hidden reward because the info you have read has been directly provided by Brian and the play rules include not to reveal this in the campaign website but only outside the campaign, so pledge at your own risk.

I know that lost leaders have been around forever, but this is an odd one. Since it's not explicitly stated on the Kickstarter page, in theory, all the backers have to get is the HOPE sticker. That's all the info listed for that specific reward tier on all of that campaign's Kickstarter page. I'm not discrediting the creator and saying, he won't go ahead with that promise, but it lies in a very grey area. If other creators would do any lost leaders tiers, I'd honestly prefer those super deal tiers like Jackson did for Sherlock and Shane did for Call of Cthulhu. At least it's a guarantee promise even if not a lot people will miss out.

[Don Boyer]

This concerns me, from the FAQ at the bottom:

Can I get a sticker as an add-on?

Nope. The H.O.P.E. sticker is only available if you back the sticker level (you can always add decks to that)

Why you ask? well because this is the Different project and sometimes it is fun to do things differently.

Nowhere in his home page or his updates does he indicate that the H.O.P.E. sticker is worth anything or will come with a handful of decks or other goodies.  He's just selling a sticker for $37.  Anyone later getting pissed off about getting a sticker and nothing else would have no legal recourse.  Doesn't mean this is something he won't follow through on, but he's certainly not obligated to do so.

Max also wrote that the creator claims the unlimited deck back won't be revealed until people actually start receiving the decks in their hands - the deck back on display in the home page for the limited edition Bicycle-branded deck.  Further, he says that the design will be chosen from design ideas submitted by backers and that the the person whose idea is chosen will receive a GROSS of decks - 144, or a dozen bricks.  (Or as I once called it, "a brick of bricks!")

There's not a single word of any of this in his campaign to back up his claims.  The more I hear about nonsense like this from a supposedly reputable company, the deeper the needle on my bullshit detector's gauge gets buried into the red zone.

EDIT: how many of you tried to click through and look at the "teachbymagic.com" website that Mr. Teach By Magic (no face, no name) founded?  I'll save you the trouble - take a look below.

Truly, an accomplishment to be proud of.

Guys - can you not see red flags here?  Proceed with caution.  The vast majority of the money this campaign has in it is coming from the H.O.P.E. stickers - and Mr. Teach By Magic isn't under any obligation to deliver more than just some 10¢ sticker if that's what you pledged $37 for.

[Sher143]

EDIT: how many of you tried to click through and look at the "teachbymagic.com" website that Mr. Teach By Magic (no face, no name) founded?  I'll save you the trouble - take a look below.

I get this page:



EDIT: I checked the updates for his previous Kickstarter campaign, the Mazing Deck (which has already been shipped to backers), and came across one with the title, "A Different Deck - Secret Reward!" but can't read it because it's for backers only. He may have announced that four decks will come with the H.O.P.E stickers.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/872009742/mazing-deck-playing-cards-with-a-twist-and-a-turn/posts

Also, I noticed he signs his updates as Brian Daniel South, so this Brian guy is probably who's behind Teach By Magic.

[Don Boyer]

I won't rule out that he's completely legit.  But his campaign does have a lot of telltale signs of being less than kosher.  I call it as I see it.

[th4mo]

Wow, did nobody in this thread actually back the "Mazing Deck"?

Here's the update where he "spilled the beans", or laid all the beans out...

OK, I just launched my 2nd project - The Different Deck.


As a valued backer of my first project I want to let you in on a secret. This deck has been in the works for quite a while. I was actually hoping to launch it on Kickstarter a year ago this month. The truth is I did the Mazing Deck to give me something to do while my artist was working on this deck.

I absolutely love this deck - each card is a unique piece of art filled with symbolism and fun and mystery.

In some respects the project is very simple but in other respects there is a lot going on - in fact there is even a secret backer level.

When you check out the project you will see pretty typical rewards and backer levels and then there is a $37 level for a H.O.P.E. sticker. This might seem strange, and that’s the idea - because it is a secret backer level.

I wanted to let you, my Mazing backers, in on the secret. It is limited to 620 spots (the number of backers my first project had) and if you back it, you will not only get the really cool H.O.P.E. decal but you will also get 2 of every deck produced by this project.

So for $37 you get 4 decks and a sticker - and if we hit the stretch goal and unlock the black deck, you will get two of that deck as well. Not too shabby if you ask me.

Mostly I am doing this for fun and just to do something... well, Different. But it is only fun if we keep it a secret so while it is ok for you to tell your friends (heck, that is encouraged), I do ask that if and when someone asks in the comment section on Kickstarter, "What the heck is up with the sticker reward and why are people backing it?" that you don't spoil the fun.

Again, thanks for supporting this Mazing adventure and I hope you will join me on a Different one.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/872009742/different-deck-playing-cards-reinvented

Best wishes for 2014,

Brian Daniel South
Creator of the Mazing deck

Did you know that in Chinese 8 is a lucky number?

I think what he's doing is pretty darn fun, and obviously the word is spreading... 291 out of 581 backers have pledged for the sticker as of right now... though amazingly, no one has ruined it in the comments section yet...

You see red flags, but i see someone who is well "outside of the box", and only just beginning to show us his talent and creativity. 

edit: BTW, his website link works fine for me too, and he has backed over 60 projects going back to May 2011, which is not typical of scammers.
Still you can't be too careful, so caveat emptor and all that...

 

[badpete69]

TH4mo.

The problem is that a comment on another project is by no way legally binding as it pertains to this project. What if the pledge level was $1000 for that sticker but he promised everyone a new car if they pledge at that level. He could raise $100k easy and then when it comes times he could decide to just send the stickers. Now I know this is an extreme example and I am not so much worried about him as the precedent this could set for many others to follow some of which might no be so honest

[Don Boyer]

TH4mo.

The problem is that a comment on another project is by no way legally binding as it pertains to this project. What if the pledge level was $1000 for that sticker but he promised everyone a new car if they pledge at that level. He could raise $100k easy and then when it comes times he could decide to just send the stickers. Now I know this is an extreme example and I am not so much worried about him as the precedent this could set for many others to follow some of which might no be so honest

Hear, hear.  You're talking about one post, set to be read by backers only, mentioned in a completely different project.  Even a verbal contract is more binding than that.  Regardless of what was said elsewhere, he's legally obligated to provide those backers at that tier nothing more than a sticker unless he states something to the contrary in this, his own current project.

[th4mo]

I never said anything about his update on the other project being legally binding, did I?
I just meant that he explains himself pretty well. And really, that's about all we have to go on in the KS arena.

After all, the fact that the Founders Deck KS contract IS supposed to be legally binding didn't stop that guy from failing to deliver, right?

This guy is putting himself out there and doing something FUN for his previous backers, and I admire that. That's all i meant to say.
Plus, it felt to me like most of the comments on this thread were being made without the benefit of actually reading the creator's full written explanation.

I've got a good feeling about this guy, and i'm trusting my instincts.

Now then, I'm really only backing this level for the decks - i could care less about the sticker...
Anybody want a "free" $37 Sticker??? 

[sr15]

Against my better judgment, I just pledged for the sticker. Few reasons I decided to go for it:

1) I like the deck design, and also think the black design could be cool
2) The KS will probably reach the final stretch goal from what I can tell, so if the message is true then that's 6 decks for pledging at that level
3) The author seems trustworthy to me, and I like to consider myself a skeptical person

I usually don't pledge kickstarter projects, partly because I don't really follow them, but this deck intrigues me. Very well may regret this later, but here's to good faith.

[TeachByMagic]

You won't be disappointed

B

[Strag]

TH4mo.

The problem is that a comment on another project is by no way legally binding as it pertains to this project. What if the pledge level was $1000 for that sticker but he promised everyone a new car if they pledge at that level. He could raise $100k easy and then when it comes times he could decide to just send the stickers. Now I know this is an extreme example and I am not so much worried about him as the precedent this could set for many others to follow some of which might no be so honest

Sadly, it's already been shown that nothing on KS is legally binding.  I backed Mazing Deck and it's very cool.  I'm in for this uniquely designed deck as well.  At least he has delivered a project before, unlike some.

[sr15]

as much as I like this deck, I can't help but think of this every time I see it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2QKlmMT8II