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Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker

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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #300 on: April 09, 2020, 09:58:26 AM »
 

the.asics.kid

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I found these two singles on eBay but besides vintage and what is written on the back (silver one "scandal"/ gold one "the eavesdropper") there're no further infos. Anyone knows additional stuff?
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #301 on: April 25, 2020, 10:57:49 PM »
 

sweethome

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Hello everyone. I am a new forum member and would like to determine the value of these KEM cards. I would like to know as much as possible about them.
I only know the models: Seville and Country Geese. Seville's cardboard box has an address in New York and Country Geese's in Stanford.
As the packages are sealed, I can only see the details that I present in the photos. I would also like to know if the boxes could be made of Bakelite.
I thank you in advance.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2020, 10:23:16 AM by sweethome »
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #302 on: April 26, 2020, 09:26:10 AM »
 

Chuqii

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Maybe $30 each. Best bet is to go to eBay and do a search for sealed KEM cards and look at the sold items.
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #303 on: April 28, 2020, 07:29:59 PM »
 

NCC1888

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Looking for information about when USPC created air cushion playing cards. I found a 1909 ad that stated it was new. Also where USPC trademarked the name in Canada in 1910. I am in contact with August Crusius's great-granddaughter. She said August was called "Air Cushion Crusius" because he had something to do with it. Anyone have any solid information?
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #304 on: April 29, 2020, 10:31:25 AM »
 

Chuqii

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I checked my 1909 Official Rules of Card Games from USPCC.  The Bicycle listing did not mention Air-Cushion finish, but other listings did.  I would guess they just didn't update the Bicycle listing, but they were available.  I don't have a 1908.  The next USPCC Official Rules of Card Games was not until 1911, and Bicycles are mentioned with Air-Cushion finish.  So, in all, I think 1909 is pretty spot on.

***** Updated ********

So around March of 1908 A. Crusius of USPCC was handing out "the daintiest little packs" showcasing new Congress designs and the Air-Cushion Finish.  Also, 1907 US Patent Office records USPCC's Air-Cushion Finish.



« Last Edit: June 20, 2023, 12:14:27 PM by Chuqii »
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #305 on: April 29, 2020, 01:00:07 PM »
 

NCC1888

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I like the book. 1909 is the concensus. Stll digging.
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #306 on: June 16, 2020, 09:13:11 PM »
 

NCC1888

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Looking for any cards, or information, about Celluloid cards prior to 1900.
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #307 on: July 02, 2020, 02:20:57 PM »
 

NCC1888

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Trying to identify 2 card backs designed for Andrew Dougherty in 1877. Any ideas? Best pictures I have.
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #308 on: July 12, 2020, 11:47:23 PM »
 

Jlav

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Hello, I'm totally new and this is my first post.
I have been given a card set and knowing it's old I've been unable to obtain any information on this set, ie where and when it is from.
I believe it was brought from Europe by my grandparents or their parents.

Here are some details:
It appears to be a bridge set including coasters, table cover, scoring book (unused), double deck case holding 2 virtually unused BP Grimaud decks, gold with symbols - one green the other red. Each deck has 3 joker's.
The decks have a compass Rose in the middle, and there is embossing around the edge of the card matt.  Each edge of the card matt has one of the poles, n, s, o(oest) and e, so I think the cards and the set are a match.
In the centre of the coasters are a crest with what I think is a harp.

I haven't been able to find any information on a set like this to determine a date for the set. I'm guessing it would have been a gift set, so any information would be appreciated.
 

Want to Learn More About Fortune Telling Deck
« Reply #309 on: July 13, 2020, 03:53:42 PM »
 

clinggi5

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Hi there Experts,

I recently found a seemingly old deck of fortune-telling cards when I received a card collection from my uncle.  Can you guys please tell me more about the deck and when it was made?? It has a velvet case as well as a booklet on how to read the cards. 

Thanks so much!
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #310 on: July 14, 2020, 09:34:37 AM »
 

NCC1888

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Since there is a zip code on the one Gypsy Witch card then they are after 1963.
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #311 on: July 20, 2020, 06:22:53 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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Hello, I'm totally new and this is my first post.
I have been given a card set and knowing it's old I've been unable to obtain any information on this set, ie where and when it is from.
I believe it was brought from Europe by my grandparents or their parents.

Here are some details:
It appears to be a bridge set including coasters, table cover, scoring book (unused), double deck case holding 2 virtually unused BP Grimaud decks, gold with symbols - one green the other red. Each deck has 3 joker's.
The decks have a compass Rose in the middle, and there is embossing around the edge of the card matt.  Each edge of the card matt has one of the poles, n, s, o(oest) and e, so I think the cards and the set are a match.
In the centre of the coasters are a crest with what I think is a harp.

I haven't been able to find any information on a set like this to determine a date for the set. I'm guessing it would have been a gift set, so any information would be appreciated.

BP Grimaud is a well-known French manufacturer of cards - they were founded in 1848 and after a short series of purchases and name changes became part of Cartamundi in 2014.
https://cartamundi.com/en/our-brands/grimaud-playing-cards/

Considering the quality and appearance of the set, it's entirely possible that the set itself was made by a different company, with the Grimaud cards simply added in afterwards by the firm that made the rest of the set's goods.  While it isn't impossible that Grimaud put this set together cards and all, something as elaborate as this would more likely go the other way around, with cards added by the maker of the other items.

The fact that the mat and the cards both have a compass rose isn't quite as significant as it might sound - it's a common decorative theme, found on a lot of home furnishings - it only signifies that the cards might have been a custom order to go with the set or it might have simply been a happy coincidence that they went together so well.

Are there any manufacturer markings on the other items in the set?

Hi there Experts,

I recently found a seemingly old deck of fortune-telling cards when I received a card collection from my uncle.  Can you guys please tell me more about the deck and when it was made?? It has a velvet case as well as a booklet on how to read the cards. 

Thanks so much!

Since there is a zip code on the one Gypsy Witch card then they are after 1963.

That's a fun deck - Gypsy Witch cards in this incarnation originated I believe in the 1930s (or at the least were popularized then) and are still in print today, though these days I think it's U.S. Games Systems that makes them rather than USPC.  USGS is best known for making many different kinds of divination and tarot decks, but a smaller collection of standard playing cards, mostly novelty/themed decks, and some of what they sell are actually made by Cartamundi - which now owns USPC, interestingly enough.

I'm in agreement in that they're definitely made after 1963 - but I might even guess that they're after 1965.  While the ZIP code was implemented in 1963, many businesses didn't follow suit with using it right away, with some taking longer than others.  However, in addition to having a ZIP code, this deck is lacking a tax stamp - if memory serves, federal taxes on playing cards were abolished in October of 1965.  Sure, it's possible the stamp fell off, but judging solely from the photo, there doesn't appear to be even a remnant of stamp glue in place on the box - even if the box was cellophane-wrapped, the tax stamp usually went directly on the box, not on its wrapper.

I don't know exactly when that Congress joker was added to Gypsy Witch cards - that might help narrow down the date it was made.  Knowing when USPC stopped using that joker would also be a good clue.
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #312 on: July 30, 2020, 08:11:47 AM »
 

Jlav

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Thank you for the input, I've been unable to identify any manufacturer's stamp or markings. Iregularities in size and shape suggest to me that parts of the process must have been handmade, while others were machine. Google hasn't turned up any similar sets or patterns either for me.
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #313 on: August 05, 2020, 02:06:32 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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Thank you for the input, I've been unable to identify any manufacturer's stamp or markings. Iregularities in size and shape suggest to me that parts of the process must have been handmade, while others were machine. Google hasn't turned up any similar sets or patterns either for me.

Very nice - handmade parts!  Workmanship like that was more common at one time in history; these days, it often only appears in either very high end goods, homemade/folk crafts or objects made in parts of the world where labor is pretty cheap - I remember obtaining a travel chess set with stone pieces that were hand carved in simple shapes, and it was I think from either India or Indonesia.  Would you say that the craftsmanship looks more high end or low end, or somewhere between?

Sounds like you've got a really nice set there.  Excellent find.
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #314 on: October 26, 2020, 10:20:32 AM »
 

Madden67

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Hello everyone. I'm not a collector and I know about cards nothing.  I just need help with a deck identification. Could you name country of origin, manufacturer and year of issue if possible? Thank you!
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #315 on: January 04, 2021, 06:26:14 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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Hello everyone. I'm not a collector and I know about cards nothing.  I just need help with a deck identification. Could you name country of origin, manufacturer and year of issue if possible? Thank you!

Sorry for the long delay in replying.

It's going to be nearly impossible to determine who made this deck and when, not unless you get very lucky.  They were somewhat common in the 1950s and 1960s, printed by many smaller companies which likely no longer exist.  "Artist model" decks featuring photography of nude women in simple, basic, arguably non-sexual poses as if for a painting or sculpture were made as a way to sell soft-core pornography (nudity without the depiction of sexual acts) while at the same time trying to avoid being classified as pornography, aiming instead to be considered "artistic."   Community standards of the time would have make decks like this the kind of thing that would be sold under the counter or in an adult bookstore, and because of the stigma (not to mention possible criminal and civil liability) that can come with such an association, many producers and manufacturers of these decks left their names off of decks like this.

The back design looks vaguely like the "banknote" style backs that were used in the Aristocrat and Blue Ribbon deck brands from Russell, which eventually became a USPC subsidiary - which itself is now a subsidiary of Cartamundi (reminds me of Russian nesting dolls)!  But I'd say it's probably not from them - more likely an imitation or a knockoff trying to look like a higher-quality product than it actually is, something that wasn't uncommon with cheaply-made decks like these, especially when printed without any manufacturer's attributions anywhere on the cards and possibly the packaging as well.  Do you still have the box?  Even if it isn't completely intact, it may be useful in identifying the maker and country of origin, possibly even the approximate manufacture date.

Your best bet would be to hunt it down the old-fashioned way at "World Web Playing Cards," over at http://a.trionfi.eu/WWPCM/ - they have a very extensive database of designs, including items along these lines.  You'll have to do a LOT of looking around, opening up image files for a number of different decks - it's going to be pretty time-consuming, but on the plus side, I don't think that they have a huge number of nude model decks on file.  You can try narrowing the search at first to just American-made decks - the "guarantee" wording is a little similar to the type that was commonly used by USPC at the time.  There's also a chance that the deck was actually made in China, even if for an American producer, though I imagine importing nude images back then was fraught with risks - I have no idea what the Customs regs were 60 or 70 years ago, but I imagine stuff like this would have been restricted in some manner.

Another possibility would be to seek out people who collect nude decks - there's a fair number of collectors who specialized in this category.  The only issue there would be that decks of this nature were printed in smaller numbers and generally more likely to wind up destroyed, trashed, etc. than ordinary playing cards would be - a bachelor gets a girlfriend, fiancee or wife who doesn't approve of porn, a mom finds them in the pants pocket of her son, teacher catches kids with them in the school yard, etc. - so there would be fewer surviving examples than other contemporary decks of the same era.
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #316 on: June 25, 2021, 11:31:09 PM »
 

Bruce

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I have a pair of Bicycle Sprocket #2 that are two different "Blue" back shades. One is blue and the other very dark (navy of maybe even black). I've done a bit of research and only see reference to red and blue.

The dark one is an Air Cushioned finish and the lighter one has an Ivory finish. The paper color on both are consistent with old paper.

Any idea what I'm looking at? Why is one so dark and one so light? Did the ink color vary that much from one lot to another?

« Last Edit: July 03, 2021, 11:42:25 AM by Bruce »
 

Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #317 on: August 09, 2021, 06:01:52 AM »
 

Don Boyer

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I have a pair of Bicycle Sprocket #2 that are two different "Blue" back shades. One is blue and the other very dark (navy of maybe even black). I've done a bit of research and only see reference to red and blue.

The dark one is an Air Cushioned finish and the lighter one has an Ivory finish. The paper color on both are consistent with old paper.

Any idea what I'm looking at? Why is one so dark and one so light? Did the ink color vary that much from one lot to another?

Hello, Bruce,

YES, you can get variations in the coloring of a card back.  I've owned decks printed in the recent past where the color of the card backs actually varied within the same DECK, never mind from deck to deck - and that's for a deck made in the "computer age," where you'd think the .  If someone at the factory used a little too much of one pigment or not enough of another pigment, you'd wind up with slight differences from print run to print run on the precise shade of the deck, though generally speaking, a blue deck would still be somewhere in the blue family of colors, as your two cards here are.

Some decks were printed with higher standards for quality control than others, so that's another possible factor that could affect the consistency of a deck's precise back color.  A really cheaply made deck (say, for example, Steamboats), was manufactured a little more on the "quick and dirty" side, while something like a gilded Army and Navy deck would tend to have much tighter standards of quality all around.
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #318 on: September 25, 2021, 02:16:50 PM »
 

excelsior

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thank you very much for your willingness to teach and answer questions! We need more people like that, willing to share knowledge. that's why I salute you. Best,
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #319 on: October 29, 2021, 06:55:21 PM »
 

Chuqii

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Having a hard time tracking this joker down, so I need some help.  Same back as NYCCC Hart's French Whist, but card is wide size.  Anyone know what brand this joker goes with?
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #320 on: November 14, 2021, 09:26:34 PM »
 

torcams

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Clay, at the risk of responding to your question with another question, here is a mysterious Japanese movie or stage star deck with the same back.  The deck is small, 1 13/16 x 2 7/8.  As opposed to the Kinema deck by the Universal PCC, this one has all Japanese text.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2021, 09:27:36 PM by torcams »
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #321 on: November 14, 2021, 09:38:45 PM »
 

torcams

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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #322 on: November 15, 2021, 10:35:05 AM »
 

Chuqii

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Thank you, Matt!
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #323 on: December 28, 2021, 04:48:45 PM »
 

Chuqii

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Ok, here's a new one for me.  I bought a USPCC Congress Rose deck, and it has a type of wavy finish on the card I've never seen on another USPCC deck.  Anybody else seen something like this on a USPCC deck or have a guess as to what this is? 

The Congress Guy, Kevan Seany, let me know this is Silk Finish.  He even has a video about it:  https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=wU0SQ7bWOI0
« Last Edit: December 28, 2021, 05:45:16 PM by Chuqii »
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Re: Ask the Experts at 52 Plus Joker
« Reply #324 on: January 01, 2022, 02:54:47 PM »
 

torcams

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Yes, this is the silk finish.  Only a couple of back designs were issued with it.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2022, 02:55:59 PM by torcams »
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