Muertos - Day of the Dead Playing Cards (KS)

[badpete69]

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/steveminty/muertos-day-of-the-dead-playing-cards

[Don Boyer]

It's not a bad design, but it is an overused theme, officially joining the "illustrious" ranks of steampunk, Cthulhu zombie decks...

I'm also a bit leery of a black deck with gold linework and a lot of detail.  The gold metallic ink when printed is NEVER as bright as it appears on a computer screen.  It's rather dark, and this would give you a dark-on-dark overall design.  It's not going to pop out like you see in the mockups, not even close.  Gold metallic FOIL would, but not ink.

[steveminty]

Hi, I'm the creator of the Deck and Pierre and Allan told me about this site. Thanks for your feedback Don! I'm looking into what I can about having it in foil as an upgrade. I would want for the backers to get the best bang for their buck

[PurpleIce]

Hi, I'm the creator of the Deck and Pierre and Allan told me about this site. Thanks for your feedback Don! I'm looking into what I can about having it in foil as an upgrade. I would want for the backers to get the best bang for their buck

Hi Steveminty,
Welcome to the forums, and always feel free to tell us more about your deck so people can understand the design process behind it. Also, you may want to let people know a little more about yourself at the "introduce yourself" section.

It's not a bad design, but it is an overused theme, officially joining the "illustrious" ranks of steampunk, Cthulhu zombie decks...

Likewise, i think the deck is nice, but an influx in recent months really makes this theme a little in the "not again..." category. The fact that i (with poor memory) could easily name a handful of decks with the same category that has been released only in this year without needing google or looking at my collection shows that it is a little overused.

Anyways, back to the deck, i just thought the smaller pips (seen on 10 Spades) makes it a little confusing. I'm sure the number 10 is a clear givaway, but i had to count the pips on the cards just to make sure. Also, does the background with the minor detailing fade off from top to bottom? I'm thinking its just how the cards are shown and the actual cards do not have a fade?

[rousselle]

Hey, Steve! Glad you could join us!

I don't know if you've gotten sample decks from USPCC showing what they are capable of with regard to metallic inks, but the best examples of metallic inks that I've seen them print are on the Theory11 White Artisan decks. They also have a lighter metallic (to the point of being more silver than gold) on the Theory11 Medallions deck. Both of these have a little bit of a shine to them, but nowhere near like if they were using a foil stamping process. (If you're not familiar with Theory11, you can find their decks at theory11.com.) The "original" Artisan decks have a silver metallic ink that works well.

Elite's "Gold" deck, which just came out from their KickStarter project (you can probably pick it up on a number of third party sites; if not now, soon), uses a metallic gold ink with black for the backs of the cards. The effect is, like Don says above, a little dark.

The Expert Playing Card company has just released their first commercial experiment with foil stamping on a deck called Exquisite Bold (available from artofplay.com). I seem to recall reading that they have a second, more extensive experiment coming out soon with foil stamping on the cards, but I don't recall which project that is. I don't think it's out yet. (Someone else on this board will recall, and be happy to jump in. )

If you scroll to the top of the Playing Card Plethora page, you'll see that the Expert Playing Card Company has an official thread there, where you can find links to talk to their representatives directly. (Note: I have no stake in EPCC; I do, however, like shiny cards, and want to encourage both EPCC and USPCC to do more in that direction.)

USPCC has the advantage of being pretty much the best card in the world out-of-the-box for cardists, magicians, and players alike, but EPCC is improving all the time, both in quality and in reputation. Would USPCC be able to mix some "metallic" yellow for your cards (in place of what they consider gold)? It might be worth asking.

Best of success to you!

[steveminty]

Thanks PurpleIce!

I had only heard of Calaveras Deck before after I had started designing this deck and the unfortunate fact that Dia De Los Muertos deck was released as I was almost done with my design, but regardless, can you let me know what were the other decks so i could avoid the pitfalls and traps they encountered? That would be much appreciated.

When it came to designing the deck, I wanted to blend the aesthetics of Dia De Los Muertos with my design style instead of replicating something that is synonmous with Dia De Los Muertos. I felt by bringing in my own aspect and style and rules, I would make this something unique that would stand out on it's own. It's absolutely unfortunate that Dia De Los Muertos is being played out but I spent months on this project and I can't let that deny the work I put into it.

The figures I used for the Court cards each had meaning into their position and their rank. All of them hold special purpose and played pivotal roles in the culture but are often overlooked in favor of the El Catrin and La Catrina type of character. I thought long and hard of how to integrate the suits of each corresponding card into the design and my end result is scene. I did that due to the fact that when I looked at traditional playing cards and covered up the number and pips, it was hard to guess which suit it belonged to.

I opted to stay away from red coloring since I thought it would not be necessary and that the designs would be easy to read. I used hollowed pips for the clubs and spades and whole pips for hearts and diamonds to facilitate that, but I've gotten awesome feedback about that so I will be playing around with working in some red to make it more distinguishable. I would love to give the backers the opportunity to unanimously decide which would be their favorite and go with that.

For the center pips, I approached it like I would a grid. I never understood why the pips were arranged the way they are in traditional decks. I understand the symmetry of having the cards the same both ways but it seemed off to me. By setting it up the way I have, I feel that the grid system is entirely consistent with the deck, never been done that way before, and something I would understand if I were looking at it from a subjective point of view. As for the gray that trails off into darkness, I apologize for that. Rest assured that the same color is throughout and does not actually fade.

You may be surprised to learn but the typograpy for the deck is entirely my own creation. I wanted to capture black letter calligraphy type but at the same time update into something more dynamic. I wish to release this type face to the public for people to use non-commercially. I feel it would be something a lot of other graphic designers can enjoy as well.

The reason why I chose to name the deck "Muertos" was due to two reasons. One, the implication and nod to the fact that it was inspired by Dia De Los Muertos and Two, due to the fact that it means Death/Dead. I think it would really funny and cool to be able to call yourself a "Death Dealer" when dealing out these cards. It's such a good pun and I find it so amusing!

Anyways! That's a bit of the tid bit of my design reasoning behind this deck and I hope it resonates with you! I look forward to hearing what you all have to say!

[steveminty]

Thank you Rouselle, you're ever so helpful. I will contact both parties and figure out how to make this the best product I can! Would it be alright if I PMed you about some questions in the near future?

[Don Boyer]

Thank you Rouselle, you're ever so helpful. I will contact both parties and figure out how to make this the best product I can! Would it be alright if I PMed you about some questions in the near future?

In my humble opinion, I feel that Expert can be a better alternative.  They've released some top-tier decks in the short time they've been in business and can produce them at a price that's more than merely competitive with USPC.  I don't even think USPC would offer gold foil on a card, just the ink.  Expert PCC is offering it, but it's something you'd need to discuss with them in terms of whether they could accomplish THAT much gold foil per card.  I can tell you, though, that if it is a job they can handle, they laminate their cards AFTER the foil has been applied, so they won't rub off the card's surface until the card's been so heavily used, it's ready to be retired anyway.

[rousselle]

Thank you Rouselle, you're ever so helpful. I will contact both parties and figure out how to make this the best product I can! Would it be alright if I PMed you about some questions in the near future?

Absolutely!

[CthulhuWho1]

I pledged for these cards about two hours ago, and posted the following comment for Steve while I was there:

Steve,
 
Love the cards, but I hope you'll consider one suggestion that I believe will make your deck even better.
Increase the size of all of your Court Card figures to the same full-size you have used for the Jack of Spades, King of Hearts, and the King of Diamonds; and you will have a much more uniform and professional deck!

Also, please follow and join the discussions of your deck on UnitedCardists.com, and on PlayingCardForum.com; where I believe they will recommend the same changes to your beautiful deck of cards. [I didn't know at the time that Steve was already doing this.]

Will Hart
Fullerton, California

[BeDoubleYou]

As a backer of Dia de Los Muertos I am extremely impressed by the artwork of this deck. In terms of advice you came to the best place that you could (in my humble opinion) Don and many of the others have a lot of experience with the industry.

I may have to pledge for a deck of these. Dont worry about the theme being a little bit oversaturated, as long as you make this a high quality product, you will have created something worth collecting and cherishing.

Very good job so far. Color me optimistic on this one.

[Rose]

Muertos- Day of the Dead is an over used theme, but this is the best one I have seen.
Looks classy and has an elegant touch. Love it

[steveminty]

I pledged for these cards about two hours ago, and posted the following comment for Steve while I was there:

Steve,
 
Love the cards, but I hope you'll consider one suggestion that I believe will make your deck even better.
Increase the size of all of your Court Card figures to the same full-size you have used for the Jack of Spades, King of Hearts, and the King of Diamonds; and you will have a much more uniform and professional deck!

Also, please follow and join the discussions of your deck on UnitedCardists.com, and on PlayingCardForum.com; where I believe they will recommend the same changes to your beautiful deck of cards. [I didn't know at the time that Steve was already doing this.]

Will Hart
Fullerton, California

Hi Will! Thank you for your suggestion. I designed the deck so that the court cards are of the same size in terms of body and skull size. The reason the cards you mentioned look bigger is due to the fact that they have bigger accessories so they take up a little more room. I went through the dilemma of resizing and sizing them and I found that the current system that I have them set worked best for me as a designer. Reason being is when rifling through a deck, I would want the eye level of the cards and the size to be the same with each pull of the card. Let me know if that makes sense!

As a backer of Dia de Los Muertos I am extremely impressed by the artwork of this deck. In terms of advice you came to the best place that you could (in my humble opinion) Don and many of the others have a lot of experience with the industry.

I may have to pledge for a deck of these. Dont worry about the theme being a little bit oversaturated, as long as you make this a high quality product, you will have created something worth collecting and cherishing.

Very good job so far. Color me optimistic on this one.

Thank you BeDoubleYou (BW?) lol! Those words mean a lot to me. I can tell everyone here is a true card enthusiast so I will look to them with suggestions.

Muertos- Day of the Dead is an over used theme, but this is the best one I have seen.
Looks classy and has an elegant touch. Love it

That's a real honor to hear that considering how awesome the other decks have been!

[steveminty]

Hey guys! After getting suggestions to make the card suits stand out from each other a little more, I have come up with the enhanced suit design and I wanted to share with you all! My design decisions in making it grey was to make it pop out and at the same time keep it in line with the current design choices. I hope you guys like it and let me know what you think!

[Don Boyer]

Hey guys! After getting suggestions to make the card suits stand out from each other a little more, I have come up with the enhanced suit design and I wanted to share with you all! My design decisions in making it grey was to make it pop out and at the same time keep it in line with the current design choices. I hope you guys like it and let me know what you think!

It's a great idea but I think it would work better in the reverse - making the black pips the lighter of the two colors and vice versa gets a little confusing to people used to the traditional design.

If you're interested, I'm a consultant to playing card designers.  One of my specialties is improving functionality.

[K]

Hey guys! After getting suggestions to make the card suits stand out from each other a little more, I have come up with the enhanced suit design and I wanted to share with you all! My design decisions in making it grey was to make it pop out and at the same time keep it in line with the current design choices. I hope you guys like it and let me know what you think!

In terms of practicality I think that you should include red in as well as black (Inside the outlined gold) for easier identification of the suits. I brought a 'Republic Sultan Deck' to a poker game and damn it was so hard to read the pips that we gave up after the first round! Since the background is dark try using brighter colours to make them pips stand out. I haven't seen metallic inks (Not gold) on black backgrounds before but I do know they look awesome on white ones as shown in the 'Mana Deck'.

[jupiter3]

   In terms of practicality I think that you should include red in as well as black (Inside the outlined gold) for easier identification of the suits. I brought a 'Republic Sultan Deck' to a poker game and damn it was so hard to read the pips that we gave up after the first round!     

   A great many of the decks designed recently (great or not so great) do not "play well" in a poker game.  The characteristics needed for poker (or other games) are not always congruent with the genius behind card design.  I once tried to put my JNugs into a poker game, they lasted only a single hand. 
   The Muertos decks are the first Kickstarter decks I have backed since the Federal Series.  The subject matter and design elements speak to me on a different level than other decks.  I may give them away as gifts to friends that hold dear the concept used by these cards. Or perhaps I'll just hang on to them.  To each his own.

[Don Boyer]

   In terms of practicality I think that you should include red in as well as black (Inside the outlined gold) for easier identification of the suits. I brought a 'Republic Sultan Deck' to a poker game and damn it was so hard to read the pips that we gave up after the first round!     

   A great many of the decks designed recently (great or not so great) do not "play well" in a poker game.  The characteristics needed for poker (or other games) are not always congruent with the genius behind card design.  I once tried to put my JNugs into a poker game, they lasted only a single hand. 
   The Muertos decks are the first Kickstarter decks I have backed since the Federal Series.  The subject matter and design elements speak to me on a different level than other decks.  I may give them away as gifts to friends that hold dear the concept used by these cards. Or perhaps I'll just hang on to them.  To each his own.

I'm curious - how did the Jerry's Nugget deck only last a single hand?  Did you destroy them?  Did you find them somehow less functional?  I would think that a deck with a bog-standard face like that would work out well for poker, though I was never a fan of the back art.

[jupiter3]

The JNugs were the absolute worst handling cards we have ever used.  I intend to get rid of them very soon.

[Don Boyer]

The JNugs were the absolute worst handling cards we have ever used.  I intend to get rid of them very soon.

While I've never actually handled a pack myself, their reputation is that they have some of the best handling in the business.  Are you certain it's an authentic pack and not a cheap knock-off?  There's been quite a few forgeries circulating around eBay - and in recent years, the forgeries have become more sophisticated, even better in quality than their predecessors, from what I've been told.

I'd wager someone on this board would be interested in obtaining that pack from you!  Several someones, in fact!

[Marcus]

The Nuggets are.. special. I would never choose their handling over a modern deck. All that talk about the handling was, and I'm guesstimating here, partly because of the hype created around them. Placebo created by a handful of people actually finding that handling to be good.

But we're getting off topic here. The Muertos deck is nice, but I would've preferred to see how it'd look with a slightly whiter shade of gold. It's a bit too dark and yellow for me right now, I think it'd work better against the black background if it was lighter.

[badpete69]

The mourning Gold deck has now been unlocked

[rousselle]

...annnnd I more than doubled my pledge.

Mrowr.

[steveminty]

Last few hours folks! Thank you Allan, Don, Pete for all of your help!