VERY limited availablity until 11:59PM EDT Sunday - Venexiana Gold @ UC $90/deck

[Mike Ratledge]

Lotrek has given me the exclusive right to pre-sell his "Venexiana (Black) Gold" decks - the world's first edge-to-edge completely foiled backs, limited edition of 200 and only 2 per customer.  His terms were 10% off to UC members only, so if you don't have an account over there, I'll have to ask you to sign up - use a throw-away username if you want, but you can't access the form to buy them unless you're logged in.  There are only about 30 of these left of my supply, and I'm not getting anything, just selling some before he uses the UnitedCardists account on KS starting Monday or Tuesday to sell the balance for $100 each - still limit 2 per person.  They were painstakingly made with him in continuous supervision of the process from start to finish on a special 330gsm French bond paper stock that's worthy of these decks.  Three of them were bought by key industry partners before they were even made, and you have a chance to get up to two at a 10% discount until midnight tomorrow night.  After that the form will be disabled.  Just look for the "Something Wicked This Way Comes part 6" forum thread in the "Site Announcement" forum.  It's at the bottom of the page in the OP.  Here's a few pix if you've been under a rock:

[Don Boyer]

It's a lovely deck - but your description doesn't seem accurate.  You describe the back as being done edge-to-edge foil - but unless that white border is actually in silver foil, it's not edge-to-edge.

I will say, however, that having foil at all on a deck like this, and in such quantity, is a difficult and painstaking process and it's a very impressive accomplishment.  This is definitely a historic deck.

[Rose]

$90 is a lot for one deck.

[Don Boyer]

$90 is a lot for one deck.

It is, but this is a print run of only 200, and it's a rare thing these days to find cards with foil on them at all, never mind in this quantity.  I'd wager they weren't terribly cheap to make.  BTW: gold foil?  Made with real gold.  Because of how thin the gold is pounded to make the foil, it's a small amount when it's just tuck box decoration, but when it's on every card in a deck of 54 as well - it adds up.

[Rose]

$90 is a lot for one deck.

It is, but this is a print run of only 200, and it's a rare thing these days to find cards with foil on them at all, never mind in this quantity.  I'd wager they weren't terribly cheap to make.  BTW: gold foil?  Made with real gold.  Because of how thin the gold is pounded to make the foil, it's a small amount when it's just tuck box decoration, but when it's on every card in a deck of 54 as well - it adds up.

Well when you put it like that they are a bargain. They are really beautiful too.

[Mike Ratledge]

My description, not his. I suppose technically you're right, but close enough. Let's just say totally foiled, then. I have to say that 8 of your users seem to agree it's worth every penny - in the past few hours, anyway... And yes, $90 is - of course - a lot of money for a single deck. How much did you pay for your JNugg - if you have one? Certainly nowhere near as rare as this deck, or ever will be. Frankly, I believe that this will sell for about the same before it is even delivered (if you can ever find one).

[Card Player]

Its a beautiful looking deck of cards...

We have to remind ourselves its not real gold, just foil made to look like gold. I'm not paying $90 for a deck of cards that I don't know the manufacture or the handling of. Your paying more then actual gold in terms of weight of the deck (paper gold). That's crazy! How low a print run it is or how rare it is to have foil on the backs means absolutely nothing to me. I'm on eBay almost everyday looking at the rare crap from yesteryear no one cares about. I have fond memories of specific decks that were the greatest thing since the wheel and super limited that most overpaid for.  "Some collectors" need to be better educated on printing techniques and how long these techniques have already existed. Its nothing new. It makes all the sense in the world getting a free rare deck for buying a brick from Ellusionist, Doesn't it? $90 for one deck, that we know nothing about other then the word "GOLD" is absurd.

We are all still just buying playing cards on these forums (Discourse & UC), Correct?

[Sher143]

We have to remind ourselves its not real gold, just foil made to look like gold.

Actually,  as Don has previously stated,  gold foil/gold leaf is real gold pounded into a really thin sheet.

[Card Player]

We have to remind ourselves its not real gold, just foil made to look like gold.

Actually,  as Don has previously stated,  gold foil/gold leaf is real gold pounded into a really thin sheet.

Look at the decks on eBay claiming to have real gold. There is very little in terms of items or products that have 99.999% gold. Adding it to a deck of common playing cards, to be owned and purchased by the "general public" will only devalue whatever % of gold it has. This was not made for or owned by royalty. This is not a vintage work by a craftsman. It can't be melted down into its pure form. It's a CON.

[Yashi]

Its a beautiful looking deck of cards...

We have to remind ourselves its not real gold, just foil made to look like gold. I'm not paying $90 for a deck of cards that I don't know the manufacture or the handling of. Your paying more then actual gold in terms of weight of the deck (paper gold). That's crazy! How low a print run it is or how rare it is to have foil on the backs means absolutely nothing to me. I'm on eBay almost everyday looking at the rare crap from yesteryear no one cares about. I have fond memories of specific decks that were the greatest thing since the wheel and super limited that most overpaid for.  "Some collectors" need to be better educated on printing techniques and how long these techniques have already existed. Its nothing new. It makes all the sense in the world getting a free rare deck for buying a brick from Ellusionist, Doesn't it? $90 for one deck, that we know nothing about other then the word "GOLD" is absurd.

We are all still just buying playing cards on these forums (Discourse & UC), Correct?

These cards weren't made to handle like whatever you're using. Obviously, this deck is targeted more at the collectors. Is $90 a lot? Sure it is! Even I hadn't bought one yet. But aside from how low the print run is, I believe the deck is rather labor intensive which also leads to the $90 price tag. The technique might have existed but I don't believe it's been done yet. If it has, providing picture of such a thing would be nice.

About the manufacturer, I don't think Lotrek mentioned it or is willing to but you could learn more if you read the discussions over at UC.

[Rose]

We have to remind ourselves its not real gold, just foil made to look like gold.

Actually,  as Don has previously stated,  gold foil/gold leaf is real gold pounded into a really thin sheet.

Look at the decks on eBay claiming to have real gold. There is very little in terms of items or products that have 99.999% gold. Adding it to a deck of common playing cards, to be owned and purchased by the "general public" will only devalue whatever % of gold it has. This was not made for or owned by royalty. This is not a vintage work by a craftsman. It can't be melted down into its pure form. It's a CON.

I have one of those decks from ebay that you speak of 99.999% gold plated! It is a really nice deck too, in a wooden box and only $14.95, too nice to play with but awesome and shiny for my collection.
It may be a con, but I like it and it didn't cost $90.

[Mike Ratledge]

We have to remind ourselves its not real gold, just foil made to look like gold.

Actually,  as Don has previously stated,  gold foil/gold leaf is real gold pounded into a really thin sheet.

Look at the decks on eBay claiming to have real gold. There is very little in terms of items or products that have 99.999% gold. Adding it to a deck of common playing cards, to be owned and purchased by the "general public" will only devalue whatever % of gold it has. This was not made for or owned by royalty. This is not a vintage work by a craftsman. It can't be melted down into its pure form. It's a CON.

Do they pay you to say all the negative crap you say?  That's pretty insulting to someone that has created the world's first really foiled back decks, and did it using three different old worlds craftmanship sites in Greece as well.  If you don't want one, that's one thing, but pooping on a damn good thing is just totally uncalled for.

I'll take the ten or so that he's allocated for sale later and tell you what they went for in about 3 or 4 months, OK?  Happy to say that I got in on this LONG before it happened, which incidentally was before Expert PCC made the Exquisite Bold decks with the star in the center of the backs.  These are also made on a 330gsm French bond (paper stock) so they don't break the web of the paper from the force used to apply the hot stamped foil like those did.  It's easy to be a critic - if you can do better, let's see it.  I can't - I'm not an artist and never will be, fortunately.  Those guys are a PITA to put up with.

There are about 30 of them left at the presale 10% off price, but if you'd rather pay $100 for them, they will be on KS Tuesday (so I was told last I asked, and they are running under my UnitedCardists account so I setup the payments process Friday evening and it's been submitted for approval but I haven't logged back in to check) - for a few minutes, anyway.  I suspect that once Lotrek publishes the update for the UC2014/Grotesque decks - if he hasn't already - including details about these going on sale, they might last 5 or 10 minutes - who knows?  15?  Doubtful.

[Card Player]

We have to remind ourselves its not real gold, just foil made to look like gold.

Actually,  as Don has previously stated,  gold foil/gold leaf is real gold pounded into a really thin sheet.

Look at the decks on eBay claiming to have real gold. There is very little in terms of items or products that have 99.999% gold. Adding it to a deck of common playing cards, to be owned and purchased by the "general public" will only devalue whatever % of gold it has. This was not made for or owned by royalty. This is not a vintage work by a craftsman. It can't be melted down into its pure form. It's a CON.

Do they pay you to say all the negative crap you say?  That's pretty insulting to someone that has created the world's first really foiled back decks, and did it using three different old worlds craftmanship sites in Greece as well.  If you don't want one, that's one thing, but pooping on a damn good thing is just totally uncalled for.

I'll take the ten or so that he's allocated for sale later and tell you what they went for in about 3 or 4 months, OK?  Happy to say that I got in on this LONG before it happened, which incidentally was before Expert PCC made the Exquisite Bold decks with the star in the center of the backs.  These are also made on a 330gsm French bond (paper stock) so they don't break the web of the paper from the force used to apply the hot stamped foil like those did.  It's easy to be a critic - if you can do better, let's see it.  I can't - I'm not an artist and never will be, fortunately.  Those guys are a PITA to put up with.

There are about 30 of them left at the presale 10% off price, but if you'd rather pay $100 for them, they will be on KS Tuesday (so I was told last I asked, and they are running under my UnitedCardists account so I setup the payments process Friday evening and it's been submitted for approval but I haven't logged back in to check) - for a few minutes, anyway.  I suspect that once Lotrek publishes the update for the UC2014/Grotesque decks - if he hasn't already - including details about these going on sale, they might last 5 or 10 minutes - who knows?  15?  Doubtful.

I'm NOT paid to use my freedom of speech as constituted to me by the U.S. First Amendment. I was born with that right as an American citizen.

I could care less if the great grandson of Nikola Tesla became the first person to put Christmas lights on a back design! 
I have no interest in trying a foiled back design myself. I won't be paying $100 or $90. I never bought Exquisite Bold but I would consider buying it before Venexiana Gold because of who manufactured it. I'm not impressed with foil.

I'm not negative about everything. You might think that but then again there is a reason you would think that. I don't recall liking anything you were ever associated with. That's your perspective of me. I don't appreciate your attempt to stereotype me as negative when its been well documented you have used inappropriate language towards customers that are members of this community.  I don't care who it is.

[Mike Ratledge]

So - you can say whatever you please - but I'm supposed to stifle what I truly feel?  That's called "reverse discrimination".  I frankly don't give a rat's pitooty if you like me or not, and I don't understand why you don't see the pattern: I just read two negative things in a row, and both were directed at me.  I suppose I could just ignore it, but that's not my style.  I'm a pretty darned easy-going person, but when somebody goes out of their way to post two negative comments in a row with absolutely no constructive criticism in them and directly besmirches the reputation of a deck designer (that's called "slander" - "libel" if you cost him a cent, by the way) it's kind of annoying, fortunately, IANAL any more.

[Card Player]

So - you can say whatever you please - but I'm supposed to stifle what I truly feel?  That's called "reverse discrimination".  I frankly don't give a rat's pitooty if you like me or not, and I don't understand why you don't see the pattern: I just read two negative things in a row, and both were directed at me.  I suppose I could just ignore it, but that's not my style.  I'm a pretty darned easy-going person, but when somebody goes out of their way to post two negative comments in a row with absolutely no constructive criticism in them and directly besmirches the reputation of a deck designer (that's called "slander" - "libel" if you cost him a cent, by the way) it's kind of annoying, fortunately, IANAL any more.

No, you have the freedom to say what you want also, you think I'm negative. I never said I did not like you. Only that I was aware I'm not the only occasional negative person on this forum, including yourself.

It's not slander. I'm not besmirching the designer. "Its a beautiful looking deck of cards." I did mention that. I'm allowed to comment on the price and its true value. If that's slander, everyone on here and YouTube is guilty of it.

[badpete69]

Cardplayer  you are allowed to post any opinions you want and of course you are allowed to not like the deck. But you are indeed going a little bit too far in calling this a con. It is by no means any kind of con, fraud or w/e you want to call it.  It is a beautiful hand made deck that will be very scarce.  If you don't want it fine  let's move in and stop the he said she said

[Card Player]

Cardplayer  you are allowed to post any opinions you want and of course you are allowed to not like the deck. But you are indeed going a little bit too far in calling this a con. It is by no means any kind of con, fraud or w/e you want to call it.  It is a beautiful hand made deck that will be very scarce.  If you don't want it fine  let's move in and stop the he said she said

You need to read a little further down.

I'm not calling the deck a con. I'm calling the use of gold foil to justify a $90 to $100 price a con. That is my opinion. You don't have to agree with it.

[DarkDerp]

It's not really a con unless it's advertised as having gold value. The marketed value added here is the foil process, the handmade, and the limited quantity.

[Card Player]

It's not really a con unless it's advertised as having gold value. The marketed value added here is the foil process, the handmade, and the limited quantity.

Many definitions for the word "Con".

[Mike Ratledge]

It's not really a con unless it's advertised as having gold value. The marketed value added here is the foil process, the handmade, and the limited quantity.

Many definitions for the word "Con".

That might well be true, but in the context that you used it, it only has one meaning: a con actually doesn't have many meanings, frankly Websters only gives two and neither of them are friendly:

verb
verb: con; 3rd person present: cons; past tense: conned; past participle: conned; gerund or present participle: conning

    1.
    persuade (someone) to do or believe something, typically by use of a deception.
    "I conned him into giving me your home number"

noun
noun: con; plural noun: cons

    1.
    an instance of deceiving or tricking someone.
    "when depositors, realizing that the whole thing is a con, demand repayment"

[Card Player]

It's not really a con unless it's advertised as having gold value. The marketed value added here is the foil process, the handmade, and the limited quantity.

Many definitions for the word "Con".

That might well be true, but in the context that you used it, it only has one meaning: a con actually doesn't have many meanings, frankly Websters only gives two and neither of them are friendly:

verb
verb: con; 3rd person present: cons; past tense: conned; past participle: conned; gerund or present participle: conning

    1.
    persuade (someone) to do or believe something, typically by use of a deception.
    "I conned him into giving me your home number"

noun
noun: con; plural noun: cons

    1.
    an instance of deceiving or tricking someone.
    "when depositors, realizing that the whole thing is a con, demand repayment"

That's not true. There is more then one way it can be used in the context for which I used it. I simply said "It's a Con". I never explained the definition for which I used it. Nor do I have any interest publicly posting the definition for which I used it. I assure you its not in your post. Maybe we should weigh the pros and cons of continuing this conversation. I meant no disrespect.

[Don Boyer]

I'm putting an end to this now - it's gone WAY out of hand.

Gold foil is gold, near 24k, but pounded so fine that it weighs next to nothing.  It's like buying Goldschlager liqueur for its gold flake content - stupid proposition.  I simply pointed it out as a point of trivia, not to create an unholy shitstorm.  You don't buy a pack of cards to melt the gold foil off of them and sell it for its gold value - that's just stupid.  People certainly don't buy it for the gold content as if they were trading precious metals - they buy it because it's shiny and pretty!!  It's also a super-rare print run, only 200 decks, and collector/speculators just drool when they hear that it's THAT RARE.

Card Player - you are free to possess and express any opinion you wish about any deck you want.  Freedom of speech.  But the last time I checked, libelous and harmful speech is NOT protected free speech.  Remember, you own your words around here and are responsible for what you write.  And honestly, I'm no lawyer, but I am not sure if the laws of the US even apply, since the forum owner is Canadian...

By the way, if you defame someone verbally, it's slander.  If you do it in print, it's libel.  It has nothing to do with the cost incurred by the defamation.  You RARELY see court cases about slander, but you frequently (in comparison) find them about libel.

Now, ENOUGH with the tit-for-tat nonsense.  Let me make this clear: having the right to free speech doesn't make every bit of nonsense you have to say socially acceptable, particularly depending on what your saying and the results it creates.  So while you're here, on this topic and this board, if you can't find something nice to say about someone's playing card offer - SAY NOTHING and I will greatly appreciate it.

Since this is a sale topic, I'm moving it to the STISO.  STISO topics are prohibited from cross-talk - only serious potential customers may reply.  Other posts will be considered spam and will be deleted.

[Mike Ratledge]

Thanks, Don - I was really uncertain where to put it, but STISO makes sense.  That being said, I have 3 decks remaining of the 90 was allowed to pre-sell.  If you want one, you need to get it soon, because I'm supposed to take it offline at midnight - but you never know, I might forget because I have to work at 7:30am so it might still be there - assuming those last three decks aren't sold - in which case it will just toss you back to the forum index, anyway.  The rest will go on sale from my UC account on KS starting on Wednesday for $100 each, and I'm sure one they hit that it's going to be "so long" pretty quickly, since Lotrek sent a note to all of his followers on Saturday afternoon.  I appreciate the assist, as always!

[Rob Wright]

Mike, thanks for extending this a day. I didn't get a chance to check it out until tonight. I love Lotrek's work. He is an exceptional artist on par with Paul or Jackson. In my opinion- 2 3 of the best going. 1 deck for me, 1 new member and a +1 for you.

[Mike Ratledge]

Thanks Steven. There are 2 decks remaining of the 90 I had, and I am headed to bed so I can get up at 7 and head to work, I left the offer available and those two will likely go overnight. Otherwise Lotrek will have two to spare along with the rest to sell from my account on KS starting on Wednesday, but at the full, $100 price. The UC2014/Grotesque decks will be delivered the week after the 4th because they ship tomorrow from USPCC to Lake Michigan Mailers, our corporate fulfillment center. The condo I paid for and sent a week or two ago now so everything will be ready to go. Of course the Signature Edition decks will come from Athens Greece...